Looking for advice regarding the installation of the PCIII on my 07 FLHTC.

I have already installed my Rush slip-ons (with 2.5" baffles) on my bike, and have run the bike about 200-300 kilometers.

Should I reinstall the stock pipes and run the bike for a bit before Iinstall the PCIII? Or can I just install the PCIII and SE air cleaner kit with the new pipes?

**Also, I will post a message next with a bit of 'history' around this little debate. See next message for history from another post.**

I AM LOOKING FOR YOUR EXPERIENCE. WHAT DID YOU DO? HOW DID THE BIKE RUN AFTER?

Let me know!

 

FROM HDF MEMBER "GLENS"

What you're going to need to do, when you get all your parts ready to assemble, is put the stock mufflers back on with the stock airbox and ride it around in steady closed-loop mode for a half-hour or so. (That's likely overkill on the time, but better to be thorough than not.) This will reset your ECU's "AFV". That's if you've ridden the bike with just the mufflers installed. If you have, the AFV will effectively change the mapping of your ECU and, trust me on this, the PC-III will be modifying signals that will be improperly rich for its settings. The result will not be to your liking if the AFV isn't reset. You could also swing by the dealer and have them do it with their Digital Technician if you don't want to hear the sewing machine anymore after hearing the Rushes. But if you do that ($$) you'll have to have the PC-III in place already, (probably) disconnect it for the reset, and then reconnect it. If you do, don't put the O2 sensors back in line with the freer-breathing stuff. Not even for a minute. Or you'll risk "messing up" the AFV again.
If you want to experiment, try bypassing the PC-III and putting the O2 sensors back into service and ride with your exhaust/air-cleaner for a few minutes with the bike warm. Then put the PC-III and O2 eliminators back into service and see how crappily the bike runs. You'll probably not be able to pull much past 4000 rpm!

You can also leave the PC-III in service with the other stuff and put the O2 sensors back into service as well. This is another good way to "mess up" the AFV and ruin the experience.

I've told Jamie (from Fuelmoto) he should make this information readily available both on his website and to his customers directly. He says the adaptive fuel value(s) aren't maintained between running sessions. Just try what I suggested as an experiment to see for yourself. I hope the guys in his shop are reseting the AFVs before they develop their canned maps. The one for my 2" Rushes definitely needs it to be reset to work well.

By way of disclaimer, since I don't have concrete documentation on this feature: If the values are indeed not saved between engine shutdowns then I've had an uncanny series/combination of glitches in my system, because everything I've done, consistently, has pointed to them being reused the next time the engine runs.


REPLY FROM FUELMOTO REGARDING THIS ISSUE

Hello, you do not need to install the stock components before you install the Power Commander. The Power Commander is ready to install and was programmed for your mods.

Fuel Moto
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Specializing in EFI tuning and Exhaust components
Visit us at www.fuelmotousa.com


MY MESSAGE TO FUELMOTO

Even if I have already installed the slip-on pipes (Rush 2.5") and have been running them for about 200kms?


REPLY FROM FUELMOTO

Hello, correct you will not need to reinstall your stock exhaust.


RESPONSE FROM "GLENS"

Hey, do what you want. I only have my own experience to go on, and like I said, it might well be that it's entirely coincidence that each and every one of my half-dozen or so times messing with it it acted exactly the same, just like the AFV was not 100% (or even very close). When in that state, the bike didn't run for crap with the PC-III in service. Pull the airbox and mufflers, replacing with stock, ride for a few miles of nice warmed-up closed-loop operation and presto-changeo bike works perfectly with the settings in the PC-III which came fro

 

The PDF manual for the Daytona Sensors Twin-Scan II says:

"At idle and part throttle, the ECM can automatically correct for modifications by changing the baseline fuel up to ±25%."

I'd heard/seen anywhere from ±10% to what I'd considered credible (but unconfirmed) ±15%. Now it could be a typo in the PDF, or they could be the most credible source. Even if it was only 15%, that would be a change from 14.6:1 AFR to 12.7:1 in one direction or 16.8:1 in the other. If the

Say your riding around with just the mufflers results in a +5% fuel. The PC-III is assuming the fuel calculated was for 14.6:1 (with the stock mufflers) but in reality the ECU is calculating what would be 13.9:1 with them (but doesn't "know" any better now because the O2 sensors are out of service with the PC-III, but that's immaterial). The PC-III has been programmed to increase the fuel by, say, 5% from the stock value. That means it's now going to be 13.9/1.05=13.2 instead of the 13.9 it was supposed to be.

Those are conservative numbers. Just think what might happen if they were double the percentages: instead, the PC-III thinking it was providing 13.3:1 would in fact be sending (overall) 12.1:1.

Get your AFV reset one way or the other. Trust me on this.

 

That certainly makes sense, Glens. No doubt about it.

Any idea why Jamie is advising against it?

 

I've spoken with him several times and he's proven very eager to help in any way he can. Like me, I'm sure he's trying to be as helpful and honest as he can be using the information he has. He's a very busy man, so maybe (and in conjunction with his vast experience dealing with situations where this didn't arise) he's content his information is as correct as can be, thus hasn't investigated it further.

The fueling offset developed while in closed loop is also used while in open loop, to transfer the necessary changes into the area where feedback cannot occur. This affects the entire operating range.

It only takes, literally, 15-20 minutes to change the mufflers back. That times two, plus another amount the same for riding, will get you where you need to be. The clamps will hold up to many uses.

 

You're right. Just being lazy I guess. I should just pop the other pipes off and do it properly. How long do you think that I need to run the bike with stock pipes in order to reset the AFV?

Also, someone else has mentioned the need to set the 0 and 100 throttle settings. You know anything about this? Is this something that I also need to do?