why are 14 Limiteds puking coolant?
#61
09-18-2013 | 12:01 PM
Road Master
Joined: Aug 2006
Posts: 944
Likes: 2
From: Tennessee
First:
If Harley is going to build a water cooled motor, they should start from scratch, quit trying to hide the radiator, and build a modern engine that as far as I'm concerned can be more than two cylinders. Don't keep dickin' around with these phucked up ideas of trying to piece something together to get by.
Second:
If your bike is leaking, drill some air holes in your tourpak so you can haul some cats around with you to lick up all of that antifreeze...
If Harley is going to build a water cooled motor, they should start from scratch, quit trying to hide the radiator, and build a modern engine that as far as I'm concerned can be more than two cylinders. Don't keep dickin' around with these phucked up ideas of trying to piece something together to get by.
Second:
If your bike is leaking, drill some air holes in your tourpak so you can haul some cats around with you to lick up all of that antifreeze...
#62
09-18-2013 | 12:08 PM
Road Warrior
Joined: Dec 2012
Posts: 1,686
Likes: 242
From: Glen Mills, PA
Lack of quality control in the plastic injected cap filler neck (inconsistent height in the two seal surfaces) and sorry vendor control of the actual cap. If it looses pressure while hot, it boils and sprays into syphon pipe into the reserve tank and out it's vent pipe to the ground. Harleys second generation bike will extend the vent pipe behind the rear wheel and cast the filler neck from aluminum. Of course Harley had to come up with an excuse owners would grasp and blames it on air in the system. However the filler neck is actually level with the highest point in the system plus the system can be manually cycled with the throttle with engine off. Any air left would syphon from the reserve tank on the first heat/cool cycle and fill the system with coolant. One should be very careful to make sure the reserve is at the cold line and check it after the first few heat cool cycles. System holds only a little more then a quart, and there is little tolerance for error. The system once adjusted as above should not be making the reserve bottle rise when hot. if it is, there is something wrong since the cap should only allow suction in when cold. If it's going out under pressure under normal riding, the first time engine gets ran hard in hot conditions, it going to spit onto the ground and empty the system.
The jammed a square peg into a round hole. I would bet the cap being at the top would cure most of this. Plus not having an overflow system is just dumb. I installed a catch can on my MX bike to avoid the mess when it overheated and it was a simple way to fix it.
#63
09-18-2013 | 01:46 PM
Seasoned HDF Member
Joined: Feb 2008
Posts: 22,607
Likes: 10,483
#65
09-18-2013 | 02:25 PM
Outstanding HDF Member
Joined: Oct 2006
Posts: 2,263
Likes: 36
From: Georgia Mountains
#68
09-18-2013 | 08:02 PM
Seasoned HDF Member
Joined: Jul 2007
Posts: 6,336
Likes: 65
From: SW Minnesota
It's pretty silly that they even bother with a coolant, heat exchange system.
As many of you have missed, anti-freeze, aka. Coolant has a higher boiling point than water which is 212'. The coolant isn't boiling in the system.When coolant gets hot, it expands and will fill the expansion tank up and when it cools, the coolant contracts sucking the level in the tank down.
One way to prevent coolant from becoming too hot when there is minimal airflow, is to create it. Via an electric fan.
Forgive me if I'm wrong, but I didn't see any radiator fans on the new bikes. I see this problem being solved by reducing coolant expansion, by removing heat from the radiators with electric fans.
All of which could be circumvented by engine oil coolers with fans on them, which like I've said before, should be stock equipment on all bikes. No under engineering necessary, HD already builds oil coolers, they just need to add them to the bikes with electrothermostatic fans. By doing this, you could see oil change intervals increased to 7,000 miles.
As many of you have missed, anti-freeze, aka. Coolant has a higher boiling point than water which is 212'. The coolant isn't boiling in the system.When coolant gets hot, it expands and will fill the expansion tank up and when it cools, the coolant contracts sucking the level in the tank down.
One way to prevent coolant from becoming too hot when there is minimal airflow, is to create it. Via an electric fan.
Forgive me if I'm wrong, but I didn't see any radiator fans on the new bikes. I see this problem being solved by reducing coolant expansion, by removing heat from the radiators with electric fans.
All of which could be circumvented by engine oil coolers with fans on them, which like I've said before, should be stock equipment on all bikes. No under engineering necessary, HD already builds oil coolers, they just need to add them to the bikes with electrothermostatic fans. By doing this, you could see oil change intervals increased to 7,000 miles.
Cripes, there have been diagrams of the system all over the internet for three weeks. Where have you been?
and yes, there is an over flow bottle!
#69
09-18-2013 | 08:28 PM
Road Captain
Joined: Nov 2012
Posts: 620
Likes: 18
From: Lakeland FL
A little bit of an update on what I have seen with mine. I have been riding around for a few days with the right cover removed so I can watch what's going on with the recovery bottle and this is what I have found.
1st of all mine does not puke all the time it has been here and there and has never been a lot but what I have noticed is most of the time when you shut the bike off the coolant only rises about a 1/4" in the tank and stops.
But every once and a while when you kill the engine you can see the coolant racing up in the bottle and this is when it will puke, so for some reason every now and then the system is over pressurizing. Bad cap maybe.
Now what I have found so far is if I force the fans and pump on as soon as I see this happening the coolant level instantly drops back to normal and it does not spill a drop. I only have to leave the fan running about 30 seconds.
So if nothing else programming the fans and pump to come on and run every time you shut the bike off would be keep this from happening at least with mine and I would bet that the same thing is going on with most bikes that have this problem.
Now this would only cure the symptom and not the cause.
And I agree with so others that other than this one problem that will get fixed this is the nicest riding best running stock Harley I have ever ridden.
So I will hang in there until the problem gets figured out until then I will just force the pump and fans off when I stop for 30 seconds, hell it takes me longer than that to get off the bike and put my crap away.
1st of all mine does not puke all the time it has been here and there and has never been a lot but what I have noticed is most of the time when you shut the bike off the coolant only rises about a 1/4" in the tank and stops.
But every once and a while when you kill the engine you can see the coolant racing up in the bottle and this is when it will puke, so for some reason every now and then the system is over pressurizing. Bad cap maybe.
Now what I have found so far is if I force the fans and pump on as soon as I see this happening the coolant level instantly drops back to normal and it does not spill a drop. I only have to leave the fan running about 30 seconds.
So if nothing else programming the fans and pump to come on and run every time you shut the bike off would be keep this from happening at least with mine and I would bet that the same thing is going on with most bikes that have this problem.
Now this would only cure the symptom and not the cause.
And I agree with so others that other than this one problem that will get fixed this is the nicest riding best running stock Harley I have ever ridden.
So I will hang in there until the problem gets figured out until then I will just force the pump and fans off when I stop for 30 seconds, hell it takes me longer than that to get off the bike and put my crap away.
#70
09-18-2013 | 11:42 PM
Road Captain
Joined: Apr 2007
Posts: 679
Likes: 119
From: Fairbanks, AK.
A little bit of an update on what I have seen with mine...But every once and a while when you kill the engine you can see the coolant racing up in the bottle and this is when it will puke, so for some reason every now and then the system is over pressurizing. Bad cap maybe...
Now what I have found so far is if I force the fans and pump on as soon as I see this happening the coolant level instantly drops back to normal and it does not spill a drop. I only have to leave the fan running about 30 seconds.
Now what I have found so far is if I force the fans and pump on as soon as I see this happening the coolant level instantly drops back to normal and it does not spill a drop. I only have to leave the fan running about 30 seconds.
I can see a scenario where the coolant is below fan-pump turn on temp at its sensor, but the heads are still locally hot near the cooled valves. Try idling for a few (seconds?-a minute?) next time prior to shutdown after a hot run to pull the heat off the heads before engine kill and see if it burps.
I've seen this heat rise at the cylinder head probe scenario after shutdown on air cooled aircraft. The fix is a brief cool down to chill the exhaust valves and seat and not an abrupt engine off.
Last edited by PA1195; 09-19-2013 at 12:19 PM.