There's a couple caveats you might want to consider...

(1) According to those in the industry, most of the tuning/remapping is done with programs other then HD's.

and

(2) Many auto-tune systems rely on the algorithms built by someone else and are, by their very nature, generic. The primary benefit of using a full-featured tuning program is allowing the person tuning to make adjustments based on their needs/wants for specific situations.

 

I don't think the EPA would allow Harley to do that. I hope the next Administration cuts the EPA's budget big time. They could do away with it as for as I'm concerned.

 

No it's not! They have to make their bikes meet EPA regulations. That's it!

There is no flexibility in those regulations that says it's OK for the manufacturer and owner to modify them how we darned well like. The only way H-D gets around providing us with tuning parts is to make them for 'racing'.

 

I don't know if this will help you or not, given that my knowledge of Harley tuning is very, very minimal at this point (although I'm committed to learning more).

Anyway, I thought the same thing as your friend was told. But since I have a Fuelmoto catless headpipe on order I decided to go ahead and order a Power Vision tuner from them just to get used to it while I was waiting on the headpipe. I asked them if a totally 100% stock bike (trike) could benefit at all from a tune, and they said yes and they would be happy to load one on the PV for me. So I went ahead and flashed this "improved stock" tune to the ECM on my trike even though the headpipe still has not arrived.

The difference is night and day, with no exaggeration. It completely transformed a dull and lifeless machine into one that now has a little spring in it's step-very noticeable. The trike also lost about 20* of oil temp in the process. I wish I had done this from day one instead of trying to get other guys to tell me that I'd be OK without it. Maybe OK, but nowhwere near this good.

Can't wait for the headpipe.

 

I don't know if "scam" applies, but there are certainly some marketing machinations going on. They're only going to go as far as the EPA requires, and that means the bean counters will play a big role in the technology they use. Narrow-band O2 sensors are cheaper than widebands, so why should they spend $25, $50, or whatever more per bike? Besides, as you point out if they gave us WB's it would allow an owner to tune the entire operating range without a dyno, and when owners can DIY it takes income away from dealers and often the Moco. Since all WB O2 sensors are currently 18mm, it's interesting that in '10 (IIRC) HD moved to 12mm sensors, which makes it more difficult to adapt WB technology (PV, PCV-AT, T'Max, EMS, etc.). That might've been partly to reduce clutter since the new sensors are smaller, but I think marketing has something to do with it. If you want to go WB you'll have to weld 18mm bungs on the stock exhaust or buy an aftermarket exhaust with them. If I'm not mistaken the 12mm sensors have heaters and newer ECM's won't work with older 18mm NB sensors (like for '07-'09). If you move to WB you eliminate the possibility of going back to 12mm sensors, that is unless you get an exhaust with both 12mm and 18mm bungs. BTW, forget O2-sensor adapters.

They can still make money on tuners, however, as they have an interest in keeping the ECM under lock and key without one. Today we can't tune a Harley without an aftermarket tuner of some kind, and I would imagine most of the tuners sold, whether HD-branded or not, are sold by HD dealers. So, the money flow continues.

 

To Hoethree and Xaran, thanks for the kudos. This stuff can get complicated and it took me a long time to get a grip on most of it, having no formal training in engineering. Trying to explain it in a few paragraphs is tough and when I proofread my replies I often wonder if I'm just making the situation more confusing. With your feedback I'm now certain my mission isn't a total failure!

I'll also say that if anything I say isn't correct I hope someone will pipe in. After all, I'm a student in this school too.