You ride deeper into the turn and apply brakes with a delicate touch as the bike is turned. Its a dance. If you grab the brakes the bike will stand up. But if you do that you probably aren't racing. If you're hanging off of it changing the CG its not so much and issue. You're very seldom not in a turn in racing so you have to brake in the turns.

 

GP racers back tire bounces in turns quite a bit as well. They have the
benefit of very good suspension. So it is combination of tires, suspension,
track, speed and lean.

I am sure that a better suspension on a HD will help as well.

I dont follow racing on tv at all. I do have a understanding of the
physics involved. My understanding is braking should be done
before the lean really begins.

The only benefit to rear braking while turning would be to unload the front
suspension.

 

Exactly! That is why gp racers have stated sticking legs out. Not
trying to help with braking that is for sure.

 

i'm going to assume you honestly don't know, fair enuf! i have roadraced for years and taken many roadracing schools, i'm a long way from rossi lol but i do understand the physics of turning and braking and why you need to learn to do it to go fast.

first of all, to avoid the bike standing up while leaned over and braking, you countersteer, apply pressure to the inside bar.

2nd you will be passed if you are not braking in the turn because the guy behind you will be able to carry more speed into the turn than you, pass you and then scrub off speed as he aproaches the apex in front of you.

the harder and longer you are able to brake entering a turn and up to the apex ( in simple terms, every corner has it's own fast way thru) the longer you can stay on the throttle on the straight before, and you go faster! hope this helps.

 

I think you might not like being told that you need to learn to use your ABS system as it was designed and perhaps give up your old riding style. That's not easy for anyone to hear but rather than disengage the system; get rid of the bike to someone who wants a bike with ABS and will be willing to pay for that feature and get yourself another non-ABS equipped bike. Good luck to you either way and ride safe!

 

First no roadracer here. Not even a "aggressive" HD rider . So my question
to you was a legit one.

I think your comments pertain more to strategy than physics. I think we
would agree that the way to win a race is to be fastest. Using brakes
will only slow you down. The quickest way through a corner would be
the one with the straightest path and highest speed. Braking does
not improve either condition.

Braking later ( or into a turn ) may indeed prevent someone from passing
but that has little to do with the physics of braking.

I would say additionally that braking later ( presumably ) at higher speeds
causes quite a bit more force on the front suspension ( and rider ), would
make it much harder to keep the back down while starting the lean, harder
for the rider to maintain cg, and more difficult from a technique standpoint
to get accelerating smoothly again. All of these things are not positives in
racing ( meaning increase your speed ), would you agree?

So I will certainly defer to your experience regarding technique and strategy
at this point I am not convinced that braking while turning is a good thing.

 

certainly street riding and racing are different and i would agree that the safest way thru a turn is to get you're braking done before. especially with the inconsistant surfaces out there in the real world as apposed to a racetrack.

if you ever get a chance to watch some motogp they will sometimes have onboard shots that show the riders right hand. it is amazing how hard and deep they brake into turns!

in basic terms, to go fast, you want to be on the throttle or on the brakes. again, late braking deep into turns allows you to carry more speed on the straights which translates to faster lap times. it is not just strategy for passing, it is the fastest way from A to B.

 

They are also on the very limit of tyre adhesion all the time, something we tend to steer clear of on the road. Racing and sports bikes also have a short-wheelbase, while our Harleys have a nice long wheelbase, so shouldn't dance around so much!

I am sure that a better suspension on a HD will help as well.

You've been reading the wrong books! I've been riding for over 40 years and learned a lot about riding before I started reading what I should be doing! It is perfectly safe to brake while turning, along as it is done with skill and care. Doesn't take long to learn how to do that.

I hope you are talking about braking with the rear brake as well as the front one?!

 

Pretty good description. Like you stated though, it's very different when you are out there doing it, not watching or reading about how to do it. The first time you miss the apex at speed is pretty telling on if a guy is gonna like it or just go through the motions. The new kid that really has impressed me is the 2010 125 champ Marq Marquez. He finished 2nd in points MotoGp 2 in 2011(his first year in gp2) and no pointed in 3 races due to crashes and didn't race the last 2 Gp's of the season(due to surgery needed after a crash in practice in maylasia). The kid has a real talent. He will be back with Repsol in the GP 2 class this year

 

Friend of mine's Son drove his ABS equipped GMC 4x4 through his garage door when a bad wheel bearing disengaged the brake. While I'm sure ABS works well under most circumstances it's those moments when you would least expect it that you get those oh **** moments. Also I wonder how many people actually try out their ABS so they will know what to expect and if they really want someone else braking for them.