Here you are once again on a Power Commander thread proselytizing about your favorite tuners, but this time you're getting more broad-minded and have added the PV and SEPST. Predictably, you also had to put in a cheer for your favorite fetish, the stock NB O2 sensor, which as you say is "there for a reason," which is to meet EPA regs. The OP asked about PC's, not our opinions about other tuners. I'm currently running a PV but won't be urging him to change his mind and buy one of these, as what he plans on buying is likely perfect for him and many other riders.

What you suggest would cost him around $450-550 at the outset, then a dyno-tune on top of that ($400 or more), which may or may not be optimal since techs are all over the map in competence. Instead, he can buy a $300 tuner, have an excellent tune already installed, and have it fitted and connected-up in minutes. Can he adjust the IAC Steps or the Deceleration Enleanment? No, but he probably doesn't want or need to.

 

It's plug-and-play, and on your '10 model bike the install should be very easy. You don't really need a tutorial since the instructions that come with the unit should be adequate. Buy from Fuel Moto and you'll have a very accurate tune already installed for your bike, and you'll get it at a very competitive price.

 

[soap box]

Buddy, you're my buddy and always will be, but the OP didn't ask about other tuners. The PC does not "leave a footprint in your ECM," and in fact the ECM doesn't even know the PC is attached. Furthermore, if you pull the PC off the bike the dealer won't be able to tell it was ever installed.

As for the factory calibration, you don't even need to save it with the PC because it never leaves the ECM. It is always there, so if you want to put it back to stock just remove the PC.

Now, who the hell with a stock Stage 1 bike wants to adjust for their cam opening and closing points? Maybe one person in 1000? Anyway, if it wasn't so utterly OT I would want you to explain how you can do this on such a profoundly mechanical operation as cam timing.

[/soap box]

 

Can the average user buy and install a TTS that has been pre programmed for pipes & Stage I intake?
Thanks

 

i-click

I'm getting tired of you calling me out. This is an open forum which you think your opinion is the only one that has merit. I never suggested a dyno tune. In fact the TTS has an auto-tune feature which does not cost extra as does your beloved PCV you have pushed for years.
Now that you have switched to a PV, you give backhanded reasons for why you have switched but at the same time, tell everyone else that the PCV is still the greatest.

I gave "my" opinion. I've read your biased posts for years which is fine but for some reason you are calling me out. I suggest you stop.

You jump in on every PC thread and now oil threads and post inaccurate info and go on and on trying to convince everyone you are the smartest guy on the damn planet. Your benefit is that you have way too much time on your hands. Get a life and do some real research before you talk about things you have no clue about.

It obvious you use this site as your way of getting members to stroke your ego which is sad and why I hate to waste one minute of my time debating your BS. Sure you have a little knowledge (just enough to be dangerous) but you let this **** go to your head.

What's really sad is the actual tuners and professionals that want to give "sound" advice to the members here have all said the hell with it since "know-it-alls" like youself berate them for their opinions.

 

Yes, basic computer skills along with a couple of cables to hook between your computer and the bike.

I'm sure the "protector of the PC threads" is typing in his way too long of a response telling you different though.

 

Isn't the PC more expensive if you get the auto tuner (about $700), a feature the TTS comes with (under $500). So if you want to tune it yourself the TTS is cheaper.

 

I appreciate all of the comments, thank you. I am always listening about other options for tuning my bike. I honestly need something simple and relatively easy to install. It is very unlikely that I will ever do heavy mods to the motor. It will probably be pipes and breather, and a tuner. Also less than 400 for the tuner is a plus, I have a limited budget. (One getting ready for college does that) So if there are better options, I am willing to look into alternatives. The owner of the company just suggested that he thought the best option was a pc for the pipes (For the money) and do to the fact I was probably not doing major changes to the motor.

 

I never said or suggested that only my ideas had merit and you're missing the point entirely. Anyway, you said it well that it's an open forum and that gives me license like everyone else to voice my opinions. As long as you (1) proselytize for TTS (et al) in a PC thread when other tuners aren't the subject or any part of the discussion, and (2) propagate misinformation on the importance of O2 sensors, I'll be here calling you out. If you'd like to discuss each in a dedicated thread, you start it and I'll be happy to participate.

The problem with OT proselytizing is that the discussion gets further OT very quickly. You make a claim about TTS, I challenge you, and suddenly the OP's original questions are a faded memory. I don't understand why one or two of you guys who like TTS can't just let PC threads be discussed by people with experience in that tuner without interference.

You still haven't engaged in any discussion about the O2 sensors, and I'd like for you to justify your claims. Making grandiose claims without details or reasoning behind them invites questions. When you don't answer the questions and continue making the claims you invite even more questions. Answer the questions I pose, discuss the topics, stop proselytizing when opinions of other tuners isn't requested and you won't have trouble with me or likely anyone else.

Here we are with even more misinformation. TTS does not and never will be able to auto-tune. Auto-tune means the AFR's are kept within specs throughout the operating range, and you can't do that with NB O2 sensors. TTS and the stock ECM cannot work with WB O2 sensors, which is what you need to do true auto-tuning.

You're misquoting me, and anyway what the hell is a "backhanded reason." Can you give one? I've given adequate reasoning why I moved to the PV in the thread about it that I started. It has been moved to the Tuner-ECM thread and is now a sticky that you can read here. If you have questions I'll be happy to answer them...over there.

Further, I never said the PCV was "the greatest," which inaccurately suggests that it is the best for everyone. I have said repeatedly that I think it is the best tuner on the market for most riders if it is purchased from Fuel Moto with a tune optimized for their bike and installed hardware. Also, I've also qualified every opinion with "IMO", "I think", or something that makes it clear that it is my opinion. I like the PV, TTS, PCV and several other tuners and feel that they have a niche in the market that will appeal to different needs. The PCV is an excellent solution for some people, perhaps most riders, and for $300 with an excellent map IMO is a bargain. Is that clear? Nowhere can you show that I've said the PCV is the greatest for every rider. If so, link us and if not please stop making false accusations. You give subjective opinions without details or links, don't answer questions when challenged, and repeat the same claims over and over again--so that's why you feel picked-on.

I suggest you stop invading PC threads when nobody asked for opinions on TTS or other tuners. If you do it in the future I'll call you out, and the same goes for the NB O2-sensor Panacea Myth that you've attached yourself to. If a subject is "What tuner should I buy", anything goes. You will never see me proselytizing on a TTS thread about how good PV, PCV, or anything else is.

Edit: In a very recent post the OP has said that he would like info on other tuners, so the parameters have changed. But when you make your claims about whatever point you engage in, please provide details and links. If you don't I'll ask.

Could you list the inaccurate information I've given? I could very well have done it, but saying this without listing even one example won't make your argument credible.

Details? Examples? Let's discuss them. If I'm "clueless," I'm sure my points would be easy to challenge successfully. Give it a try.

"Sound" doesn't necessarily mean whatever you agree with. I have good discussions wiith "actual tuners and professionals" here and other forums and it's only you and one other person who I repeatedly feel the need to challenge. The others give details, don't make personal insults, and are willing to discuss the topics. They also frequently change my mind.

I can't discuss anything with you unless you are also willing to discuss these topics. All I get is personal insults, and that doesn't add credence to your points. If you will discuss what you believe in, not just make claims, and make a good case for these concepts, I'll be the first to acknowledge it.

 

If you buy TTS and don't have access to a tune you will need a dyno-tune. Period. It does not auto-tune the entire operating range and can't physically do it with the NB O2 sensors. So, add $400 or so to the base cost of TTS. Anyway, the PCV Auto-Tune, which does true auto-tuning of AFRs, costs $600 from Fuel Moto and really isn't necessary for most riders.