I'm running Power Vision now, still using AT to tune with, but when I had the PCV I had it running in "learning mode" (AT active) 99.9% of the time. Only in slow-moving traffic did I switch to the rich base map.

As for accepting trims, I never did that after establishing my rich base map, as that would've defeated the purpose and changed it to a much leaner configuration. I did accept trims early-on after running AT for a while using rich Target AFR values, which established my base map. Read the first post in this thread, as I explained that in detail.

 

Iclick, I have been searching through the threads and see mention of setting AFR's for the idle rpm bands (1000-1250) to get the best idle characteristics. I see zero's in your tables which indicates no further auto tuning will occur if I have studdied correctly. Any suggestions as to an AFR that would be a good place to start? I am getting up to speed on setting the values at zero and zeroing the trims once the idle is correct. I am running Jamies base map for my cam and exhaust combo and am just now starting to figure out how lean I can go for cruise and to have an idle that is more stable. your write ups have been excellent. Thanks, Tim

 

IClick, when you were adding timing on your map how were your trims reacting? I started adding timing and listening for detonation, and also logging runs with the LCD and Ive heard nothing or has the logs shown that timing was being retarded by the ecm so I think Im on the right track. Im not sure if its just me but the bike seems to have a little more throttle response and get up and go. The AT trims have always fluctuated 2 or 3 numbers as I ride but since I added the timing there are a few 4 and 5 and one oddball 6 changes all to the negative. Does this sound right? Ive read somewhere that I should also see a drop in oil temp with the added timing but Im not sure if what I saw was due to the map change or the temp outside, Ill have to keep an eye on that.

 

What size is your engine?
What kind of mileage are you getting?
Is there any way a 103 can run on regular gas?
Thanks

 

DJ doesn't recommend auto-tuning at 0% TP, I suppose because some configurations may be afflicted by reversion. I was having a problem with an over-rich condition at 2000rpm that made me want to make a correction. What I did was to set a value (like 14.0) to that entire column and run the bike a while to establish some trims at 0%. I didn't see anything weird that would suggest reversion (like heavy correction toward a richer trim) so I manually adjusted the Fuel Adj. tables by adding or subtracting the trims to the Fuel Adj. tables (both), and then changed the Target AFRs back to zero.

You could Accept Trims, but that would affect the entire table, and if you've set-up the map-switch function as described in this thread you don't want to make changes to the base map after establishing the richer values if you're running in the leaner learning mode. IOW, if you Accept Trims you should only do it while creating the rich base map, not later on when you're using the leaner Target AFRs while in learning mode. I hope this explanation is clear.

Since you aren't in the 0% range often, or if you are it isn't going to affect performance, so I don't think it matters much. The only exception you may run into is decel pop if the AFRs are too lean, or as in my case that over-rich condition in one location. The tuning run with the AFR values inserted got it running well and I didn't change them after that. Here's a summary:

1. If you're presently establishing your rich base map, you could change Target AFRs in the 0% column for a while and Accept Trims. As long as you have those rich Target AFRs in place you can Accept Trims all you want.

2. If you've already established your rich base map and are running in learning mode (AT), you wouldn't want to Accept Trims, as that would adversely alter your rich base map. You could set the Target AFRs at 0% to an AFR value (e.g. 14.0) for a short-to-moderate run in order to get some trims established there. Write down the trims and apply them manually to the Fuel Adj. tables in their correct places, then change the Target AFRs @ 0% back to all zeros. That way you won't be altering any trim value above 0% TP.

 

Timing shouldn't affect trims at all. I added some advance in the cruise range until I heard detonation and then backed-off 2°, as per Jamie's suggestion. This worked well for me. The knock retard function of the ECM will work on incipient knock, which is inaudible, but if you apply a quick throttle input and you're too advanced you should hear a brief knock event. That was my method anyway.

I believe that the ideal ignition advance is that point just before incipient detonation, which may not be audible. That's why I used the ear method and backed-off 2°, which should cover that brief area where incipient knock might occur. If this happens the ECM will retard the timing in that location, so you don't want this happening often. If the ECM sees knock often enough in a given area it will apply its adaptive knock function and reduce advance in that area until the knock disappears.

Again this my 2¢, but I think maximum advance up to that point of incipient knock is ideal for cooling and throttle response, although I haven't felt any difference in my bike one way or the other. In my case we're talking about 2-3°, which I doubt is a change that could be felt in the seat of your pants.

 

Iclick, thank you sir for the detailed repsonse. My map is performing very well everywhere but long term stop and go idle using FM's header, carbon mufflers, and a 555 cam. That said, I believe his base map is based on the asymetrical baffle design of their touring mufflers.
I asked Jamie for some guidance and he indicated I could watch the AFR's realtime (plugged into the laptop) and adjust an AFR in the tables (0% col) to help correct the low/lean idle condition. He thought I should start at 13.2. I was trying to understand the process.
Get the real time displayed AFR's richer and then fix the map table value after watching the AT trims. Then put a zero back into the AFR table to keep AT from changing those 0 TP cells. Thanks again, Tim

 

Actually, I've used this method before and didn't think about suggesting it earlier, as it is likely the best option for you. Leave your Target AFRs set to 0 in the entire 0% column and go to your Fuel Adj. table, front cylinder first. When the bike is thoroughly warmed-up, connect the computer to the PCV and start the engine. Highlight the 0% @ 1000 RPM value and wait for the AFR values to begin showing in the display. You can change the values quickly in real time by using the Pg-up and Pg-down buttons on the computer along with Insert. Pg-up and Pg-down will change the value by one up or down each time you hit the key, and you can insert it in the PCV map in real time by hitting the Insert key. Do this until the AFR is where you want it, then do the same for the rear cylinder.

 

Im in process of build
my idea is when all done is to hook up pv with auto tune
My question is has any one added one to an already dyno tuned bike knowing that was set right for what was wanted / needed then using at to run as you say in economy mode for trips etc
sencond my thought after a long trip across country 2summers ago real hot temps in south and highest gas i saw was 90-91 so other idea is to store one other map of my original with only change in reducing timing as an oh **** for gas purposes
has this been tried?
Third is there any format of emu reprograming that it wont recognize?
thanks

 

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