Best "mild" cam for 96" baggers??
#41
I am going to do a cam change this winter. Up until now, my bike is a bone stock 07 FLHT with an Andrews 30T belt sprocket (love it)
Intake closing less than 30deg ABDC indicates a low speed torque cam
Intake closing 30deg-50deg indicates a mid range torque cam
Intake closing greater than 50deg indicates a high speed power cam
Stock cam specs for 07-08:
Lift @ valve Duration @ .053 timing @ .053
intake/exhaust intake/exhaust lift open/close
.484"/.484" 198deg/222deg 12deg ATDC/30deg
SE-255 specs
Lift @ valve Duration @ .053 timing @ .053
intake/exhaust intake/exhaust lift open/close
.569"/.569" 211deg/235deg 6deg BTDC/25deg ABDC
48deg BBDC/7deg ATDC
ATDC= After Top Dead Center
BTDC= Before Top Dead Center
ABDC= After Bottom Dead Center
BBDC= Before Bottom Dead Center
I have read all of Minton's stuff about cams & the 96" motor. IMO, the Andrews 21 might be a great for an 88" motor but it will not be going in
my 96" motor. The Andrews 26 has been recommended, but I am still
not sold on the 26 for a 96". Andrews now has a new, somewhat simular cam recommended for the 96"-103" motor, the 54H.
Intake closing less than 30deg ABDC indicates a low speed torque cam
Intake closing 30deg-50deg indicates a mid range torque cam
Intake closing greater than 50deg indicates a high speed power cam
Stock cam specs for 07-08:
Lift @ valve Duration @ .053 timing @ .053
intake/exhaust intake/exhaust lift open/close
.484"/.484" 198deg/222deg 12deg ATDC/30deg
SE-255 specs
Lift @ valve Duration @ .053 timing @ .053
intake/exhaust intake/exhaust lift open/close
.569"/.569" 211deg/235deg 6deg BTDC/25deg ABDC
48deg BBDC/7deg ATDC
ATDC= After Top Dead Center
BTDC= Before Top Dead Center
ABDC= After Bottom Dead Center
BBDC= Before Bottom Dead Center
I have read all of Minton's stuff about cams & the 96" motor. IMO, the Andrews 21 might be a great for an 88" motor but it will not be going in
my 96" motor. The Andrews 26 has been recommended, but I am still
not sold on the 26 for a 96". Andrews now has a new, somewhat simular cam recommended for the 96"-103" motor, the 54H.
#42
Well, I for one appreciate everyone's comments, but really appreciate the link to Harley's Screaming Eagle on line catalog, which is a wealth of information on cams. Here is how to get to it:
Go to the HD website at www.harley-davidson.com , click on "Experience" and then on "Racing," then on "Screaming Eagle Pro Parts," and then the second download link of the Screaming Eagle catalog.
Scroll to page 20 to find the cam specs. Note the stock TC96, as Iclick stated, already has a cam that closes the intake valve at 30 degrees ABDC. By scrolling down farther you can find that the 110 motor apparently is using the SE255 cam, which is closing the intake valve at 25 degrees ABDC. This contradicts, or corrects, the information in Minton's articles in American Rider, who assumed the SE 110's had a cam closing close to 30 degrees ABDC. I do note, however, that the info on the stock cams states '07 and '08 engines, we we really don't know for sure about the '09 and '10 engines. As we all know, the '10 engine is really strangled by the EPA.
In my case, on a TC88, it appears I went from an intake closing at 40 degrees ABDC and a -5 degree overlap (info from the nightrider site), to one closing at 30 degrees. That's a substantial change, and certainly felt in the butt dyno.
Go to the HD website at www.harley-davidson.com , click on "Experience" and then on "Racing," then on "Screaming Eagle Pro Parts," and then the second download link of the Screaming Eagle catalog.
Scroll to page 20 to find the cam specs. Note the stock TC96, as Iclick stated, already has a cam that closes the intake valve at 30 degrees ABDC. By scrolling down farther you can find that the 110 motor apparently is using the SE255 cam, which is closing the intake valve at 25 degrees ABDC. This contradicts, or corrects, the information in Minton's articles in American Rider, who assumed the SE 110's had a cam closing close to 30 degrees ABDC. I do note, however, that the info on the stock cams states '07 and '08 engines, we we really don't know for sure about the '09 and '10 engines. As we all know, the '10 engine is really strangled by the EPA.
In my case, on a TC88, it appears I went from an intake closing at 40 degrees ABDC and a -5 degree overlap (info from the nightrider site), to one closing at 30 degrees. That's a substantial change, and certainly felt in the butt dyno.
Last edited by MNPGRider; 10-01-2009 at 05:57 PM.
#43
This is what the catalog says about the SE255
SE-255 CAM KIT
The ultimate in torque cams, this cam offers substantial
increased in low end torque for engines up to 110 cubic
inches with compression ratios up to 10 to 1. The low end
torque increases are great for heavy bikes or for the person
who routinely shifts below 4500 rpm and wants the power
available to pass without downshifting. The cam still makes
peak power above 5000 rpm so people with lighter bikes will
enjoy the torque increases without feeling like the bike runs
out of air at higher engines speeds. These cams are used in
the ’07 and later street legal 1690 Stage II kits and the 110
Stage Kits. Compression releases may be required depending
on displacement and compression ratio.
SE-255 CAM KIT
The ultimate in torque cams, this cam offers substantial
increased in low end torque for engines up to 110 cubic
inches with compression ratios up to 10 to 1. The low end
torque increases are great for heavy bikes or for the person
who routinely shifts below 4500 rpm and wants the power
available to pass without downshifting. The cam still makes
peak power above 5000 rpm so people with lighter bikes will
enjoy the torque increases without feeling like the bike runs
out of air at higher engines speeds. These cams are used in
the ’07 and later street legal 1690 Stage II kits and the 110
Stage Kits. Compression releases may be required depending
on displacement and compression ratio.
#44
Okay, I gotta admit it...this cam talk has intrigued me. Never messed with bike motors before, but dang this has got my blood pumping. Being a devout Pontiac car dude makes me want to get my 96 thumping.
Does the 255 cam give the bike a EVO like engine lope sound? I guess I haven't paid much attention around other bikes as to the sound if they even have changed out the cams.
Does the 255 cam give the bike a EVO like engine lope sound? I guess I haven't paid much attention around other bikes as to the sound if they even have changed out the cams.
#46
Just curious, but was it possible your 26s were producing an improvement over stock, just not the peak numbers you were looking for. For example, if your peak torque was 81 and the curve was absolutely flat from 2000 RPM to 5000 RPM that would be an excellent torque curve and an improvement compared to stock cams.
Here's a composite I did of some dyno charts I acquired from Fuel Moto and the dyno section of this forum. You can see the results of the TW26 in the TC96, and it doesn't look like the low-end was favorably represented by that upgrade, at least not in the hands of that tuner. Admittedly, these are different dyno tunes by different tuners, and we don't know anything more than that, except that the FM tune was done competently. As I mentioned on a previous post, the SE255's were in combo with TD's which hurts the low-end, and I know the low-end would improve noticeably using stock head pipes or 2-into-1's. This dip from 2700-3200 is shown on the top chart of the first scan.
Last edited by iclick; 10-01-2009 at 11:25 AM.
#47
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