Here is the reply from nightrider.com

"Your XiED's are all you need. The ViED's will not make the mixture any noticalby richer than the XiED's, only give you the ability to make the mixture noticalby leaner. So put your XiED's on the bike. You can also put your air cleaner upgrade on the bike if you want."

So to answer the original question, yes, the xied's will do the job.
Nice to see they are not trying to sell something not needed.

 

Great topic, I was thinking about doing the same thing. I have 1.75" rush baffles on my 2008 ultra. Let me know the outcome once you install them.
Thanks & ride safe!

 

Because of this thread, I emailed Nightrider too. I used my bike, 08 Ultra, Rush 20's and stage 1 as an example. Their response was that the combo would be/run fine. They added that, "IF" desired, a dyno tune could be done to ensure every bit of available power was extracted.

 

Why is it that when I posted this very question about two weeks ago I got completely opposite responses as all said no way it won't work!

 

Hi from Perth Western Australia.
I run a 2008 FXSTC Anniversary Softail custom.
Khrome werks 3" HP Plus tapered mufflers
K&N HD-1499 stock airbox filter
XiED's from day 1.

I was actually submitting results to nightrider on the performance of XiED's on
" HDI International models" This is the sum total of my results...

Definite power increase on my '08 Softail custom. All tied in with the Khrome Werks 3 inch HP-Plus mufflers and K&N standard airbox air filter. ABSOLUTESUTELY the best bang for the bucks spent!

As I have posted elsewhere my bike runs well against Power Commander PC3 and SERT race tuner equipped bikes. In 2 cases the riders had spent between 2.5 and 3K dollars on their setups and were quite surprised when my setup pulled away quite convincingly. These guys are regular riding mates of mine and they were having a real go believe me !!

Another mate of mine has an '07 Heritage set up just like mine and it pulls almost as well,considering it's a heavier bike to start with. (however he's a skinny fuc*** and I'm 91KG!).So what I'm saying is my bike is not a "one off"

Even the supplier of the Xied's is the first to admit that a dyno tuned bike with a race fueller of whatever kind will develop more ultimate Horsepower at max revs, The question is....

"How often are you up at those revs on the road?"

I'm happy with mine and wont be doing any further mods,and all I've spent is under $600 Aussie IN TOTAL for all the above listed mods. No dealer cost for labour because it's all really Mickey Mouse to do.

 

Ordered the XiED today. After suffring from fried right leg this past trip to Sturgis, I'm hoping for some relief for sure.

 

You will be very happy with them. Money well spent!

Aaron

 

All the *IEDs are merely means of externally adjusting the Closed-Loop Bias tables in your EFI computer. They are not suitable for use as a sole means of accommodating freer-breathing equipment without reprogramming the EFI, and if you reprogram the EFI, you don't need them. It's as simple as that.

Steve at Nightrider is basing his information that it's okay to go with a freer/different flowing airbox on a blurb in the Enthusiast magazine from late 2006, and evidently from magazines such as AIM, who're repeating their sponsor's advert lingo.

If you were to get the software for the new TTS tuning system you'd have "stock" breathing stuff and "stage 1" breathing stuff EFI programs to compare and you'd plainly see that the bulk of the improvement in breathing by a "stage 1" airbox is outside the closed-loop area of operation. The *IEDs count on the closed-loop operation, where the EFI will (within limits) correct the fueling needed.

I've had extensive private communication with Steve and he's not answered any pertinent questions with anything other than positive field reports. Many of those reports where I'm familiar with the reporter would cause me to question the validity of the reports.

Just compare the fueling maps and you'll see that adding fuel while closed-loop, but not while open-loop, with any significant breathing mods would be a very foolish thing to do.

I'll not be in the market for any used '07s or later unless I know precisely what's been done with them, that's for sure.

 

Glens
Maybe I misunderstand your comment. I was under the impression the closed system, on the newer Harley's, becomes an open system after a given RPM. That is, it is closed loop under approx 4200 rpm and becomes open, (to increase the fuel) after that approx number.
If the IED alters the closed loop and the system increases the fuel after the throttle is taken out of a "cruise" mode, why is this not a good thing?
That sounds like proper operation to me. More fuel, (via IED), in the lower ranges and more fuel via the incorporated system when the throttle is opened up. Isn't that what this discussion is all about? I had thought we all essentially agreed a lean fuel mixture is not only hot, but also very hard on the engine.

 

Until the '09s, evidently, folks have been able to intercept and alter the O2 sensor output to trick the ECU into providing more fuel while operating closed-loop. This is a setting within the SERT/SEST/TTS software, if you have one of them, to accomplish the same thing (and the software strongly suggests not going beyond a certain target voltage, which the XIEDs do by a fair margin).

You're correct that the closed-loop operational area is generally confined to the lower engine speeds, but it's not quite that cut-and-dried. At any rate, the stock breathing apparatus in combination with the stock EFI programming does not provide a lean mixture while open-loop. The "leanness" that everyone blames the heat on is during closed-loop operation. So folks who can can put a voltage divider between the O2 sensors and the ECU to make it seem like it's leaner than it really is. The ECU will dutifully add more fuel to get the voltage correct and this will cool the engine down a little. This works well so long as they don't go too far (as in XIED).

When they open up the airbox, the bulk of the airflow increase is obtained at the larger throttle openings, when the butterfly valve gets out of the way. This also corresponds to the area of operation where the ECU programming is the only thing used to provide the proper mixture (the O2 sensors are not used there). Opening up the airbox necessitates reprogramming the ECU, since we don't have a direct airflow measurement like autos/trucks do. For us, the amount of airflow (thus the amount of fuel required) is derived, not measured directly.

Folks who're replacing their breather assemblies without adding more fuel open-loop are foolish. Especially with a $20k vehicle. If you have a means of providing more fuel open-loop (like you should with intake changes and/or exhaust system type changes) then you don't need any of the IEDs because you'll also have the ability to make fuel changes in the areas they cover, too.

The only way I'd advise to use IEDs (not the "X" model) with a freer-breathing intake would be to do so in conjunction with an appropriate dealer ECU download.

You're correct that the system provides more fuel open-loop, but it's more fuel for proper operation with the stock breathing parts. It won't provide the more more fuel it needs with freer-breathing gear until it's been told it's using the freer-breathing stuff. So what'll happen is the more fuel provided open-loop won't be enough and it'll be running leaner than stock with no means of knowing it is. It'll do it 'til the day it dies, which will likely be far sooner than it would've been.