2008 Ultra, stock. bike has 15k (bought it used with 5k a year back). Brand new battery in the bike.

Primary started making noise last summer on startup so installed a new SE Compensator 2 weeks ago. I replaced the stock tensioner with the Southern Hot Bikes primary chain tensioner.

After that I still had a bit of primary noise and a bang or chain slap on startup (first 200 miles of comp install) so I also installed an All ***** starter clutch yesterday. (All *****- this thread on starter grind)

Bike fired fine this AM....rode 100 miles and stopped for gas, after filling I went to fire the bike to move it from the pump and a loud CLANK came from the primary. I moved it, then turned it off and then immediately tried to restart to see if the noise happened again. This time it was like the engine wouldn't turn over- I could hear the starter clutch spinning the large ring gear in the primary, but it huuuuuung and paused for a second like it didn't have enough power to turn the engine over, then it fired up. (this has happened a few times since the SE Comp install).
Note- the bike has a brand new battery.

So....

with a new compensator and starter clutch, what could be causing that 'clank' on startup? This was louder then pre-SE comp.

what causes that 'pause' when going to fire up- like the battery doesn't have enough juice to turn the bike over? kinda like you can hear the crank starting to spin, but it haaaangs a bit, then finally fires up. what causes that?

Any input appreciated. It appears (?) when I shut the bike off if I wait a bit the issues subsides, but waiting isn't always possible if you're on the move or moving from a busy gas pump etc.

please no suggestions to 'immediately' put in a Baker etc. All installed parts are new. If this was happening 20k later, maybe no issue, but 200-500 miles later is an issue.

 

What you're experiencing is the famous Harley "hot start kickback". Can happen with certain cams, like the SE255. Engine stops on compression stroke when you shut down, & there is some gas in the combustion chamber which ignites when you try to start it. Try the cheapest fix first...make sure your battery terminals are tight;loose terminals can cause this. Even with a new battery, my RoadKing shakes the terminals loose every few rides; they may not actually FEEL loose, but put a wrench on 'em & you'll see them snug up. This will cause hesitation on starting, too. After I installed my SE comp, the bang went away.

 

Thank you. 'hot start kickback", read a couple of your threads on it (and others like this). Haven't had this issue on any bike I've owned before. My 2013 FLH doesnt do it (stock), but the 2008 does. AND, it didn't do it until the SE comp was installed.....that or I never fired the bike frequently enough when hot to notice.

Hmmm.....this would make sense when moving the bike from the pump yesterday. It was really embarrassing (super loud), but more of an issue to me was having an issue w/ a new SE comp installed and a new starter clutch and why it was happening

So if this IS the issue, what is the mean wait time for the compression to dissipate & bleed off before firing back up the bike? 5 mins? 10 mins? or how to manually release the compression w/out installing manual releases etc....I see the blip the starter approach in many threads. I read something about clicking into 4th gear and rolling the bike??

This now has me wondering about compression releases and if stock HD's are pre drilled for them (guessing not). Would need to go check my bike. Would have no issue w/ manual ones.

With a new Comp I'm unsure how it could fail so quickly....and if its the issue.

Edit to add: battery terminals are tight, just re tightened Friday after putting in the new starter clutch. Thanks.

 

I have an 08 Road King that has had similar issues. I have a couple of suggestions to try/consider. I was having kickback issues and found that I was letting off the start button a little earlier. The bike catch a spark but not really start, I'd let go to soon and get the kickback and a fart back through the intake. Try camping out on the starter button until you know it's definitely running. Another thing to try would be to turn it on and start it right away. I have read on the forum people have had success with this instead of wafting for the light to go out.

As far as the hanging on start then fires right up, sure sounds like a weak battery or loose connections. Keep in mind that a new battery doesn't necessarily mean a good battery. You might want to have it load tested just to be sure.

I doubt very seriously your comp has failed. When you have a strong kick back like you described, it's going to push the compensator to it's limit and bang. It's there to act like a shock absorber. Hit a big pothole and even the best shock can bottom out.

Good luck!

 

Thanks. Sure hoping its not the new Comp.

Holding the starter button longer- have read that elsewhere- only issue w/ that is the 'BANG' happens when you press and hold the starter button, so unsure how holding it longer will prevent that loud bang? (maybe I'm missing something). No kickback thru the intake in my case (that I noticed, but will pay attention to that next time). I also tried the 'fire it once you click the RUN switch' thing and it didn't help.

Not too worried battery is bad, its directly from Deka a month back and connections are prob overtight versus too loose tho will keep eye on it as a potential cause of course.

The compression info I'm reading kinda makes sense to me as I hear the starter clutch winding the ring gear (?) but then the haaaaaaaaaang happens....that must be where the starter is trying to overcome the compression still in the engine? (makes sense to me, but still reading on this issue)

Thanks again. Seems ridiculous to have an issue like this...I cant imagine buying this bike in 2008 and having this happen out the door. That would have pissed me off.

 

bump....wondering if there's any other input on this....or if the 'hot start issue' sounds like the ultimate culprit.

 

Every wire has TWO ends. Just because the battery ends are clean and tight is no guaranty that the other end is the same. Hate to suggest you open up the primary again, but are you ABSOLUTELY certain that none of the belleville springs fell between the crank shaft extension and the rotor? The clank is usually when the compensator runs out of travel and the moving part smashes against the stop. If one of the springs is not where it belongs,or installed backwards, you might be very light on spring tension and the new compensator is just as, or more sloppy than the the old one.

 

springs were double and triple checked- concavity was correct- the SE instructions stated to look for a spring falling behind the extension so was careful to check that....if I have to will pull primary cover and re-check again but wanted to do as a last resort.

Seems this only happens when bike is hot.

 

Did your compensator come with any shims? Harley had some trouble with quality control on the springs and some new compensators were loose from lack of spring pressure. Installing one or both shims should provide more spring force and keep the moving pieces from hitting the stop. If there were no shims in the kit, check with Harley for a shim package, I believe it sells for less than $10. Something has to be wrong, I suspect something like the cupped side of the smallest spring facing the rotor instead of facing the sprocket, but I wasn't there to watch the install.

 

Ok you have me re-reading now...and in old old compensator bulletins it mentions shims (pre-05). In a bulletin from 2013 (pic below) it actually SHOWS the shims?
Now in my install PDF that came in the box from HD (p/n 40100061) it mentions the shims (see pic w/ arrow) but in the exploded parts diagram there are no shims, and they were not included in the kit? Kinda have a WTF going on here....





PDF of comp install from few years back. My part number is not mentioned in this PDF


THIS IS THE PDF THAT CAME IN MY COMP FROM HD.


MY INSTALL PDF MENTIONS THE SHIMS AS WELL??


BUT THERE ARE NONE IN MY PDF PARTS DIAGRAM??


OR IN MY PDF PARTS LIST??