Automatic primary chain tension adjuster?
#35
2007-2011 auto primary chain adjuster.
Recently had primary drive issues. Seems my problems are shared by many.
I read a number of blogs on here pertaining to issues in the stock primary drive system, to include the compensator, clutch hub, and auto tensioner.
Upon inspection, (removing the primary cover) I discovered damage to the compensator, and clutch hub.
Evidently, from reading a number of blogs, and talking to other Harley owners and mechanics, Harley installed weak compensators in their '07-'11 96 c.i. twin cams. To complicate matters, the auto tensioner gets so tight, it causes premature failure of the transmission output side bearing, etc. Also, when removing the compensator and clutch, (you have to remove both at the same time) I discovered another problem. Roughly 3/8"-1/2" of the inner splines of the clutch hub were broken off and floating around in my primary housing. The clutch hub/broken spline problem was a somewhat common problem others were having too. Evidence of the weak compensators became apparent when ordering the Harley suggested SE upgrade compensator. They were on back order. I also had to order a new clutch hub to replace the damaged one.
I believe the main cause of these issue is the auto-tensioner. It adjusts itself as tight as a piano string, and creates havoc for the rest of the drive components.
I talked to 2 Harley mechanics at 2 different Harley dealerships, and they both told me that if I didn't change out my weak compensator, it could cause catastrophic failure of my primary drive components and more. I know now that, that was only part of the problem.
After installing the new SE upgrade compensator, and the new clutch hub, I still wasn't confident I had corrected the issues, with the way the drive sounded and the bike performed.
That's when I realized the tensioner was the culprit. I decided to alter my auto tensioner from auto to manually adjustable. I didn't really want to spend an additional $200 to purchase a Baker manual adjuster. (I decided from research and reading blogs, that this was a good one) The factory auto tensioner has good components, so with a little time and about $1.50, it seems to be functioning just fine, and much of the whirring sound is gone.
Sorry for being so long winded here, but felt the need to share my experience. I'm somewhat disheartened by my Harley experience, especially when Harley hasn't ponied up to remedy this issue. They're more than willing to sell you new parts though.
I read a number of blogs on here pertaining to issues in the stock primary drive system, to include the compensator, clutch hub, and auto tensioner.
Upon inspection, (removing the primary cover) I discovered damage to the compensator, and clutch hub.
Evidently, from reading a number of blogs, and talking to other Harley owners and mechanics, Harley installed weak compensators in their '07-'11 96 c.i. twin cams. To complicate matters, the auto tensioner gets so tight, it causes premature failure of the transmission output side bearing, etc. Also, when removing the compensator and clutch, (you have to remove both at the same time) I discovered another problem. Roughly 3/8"-1/2" of the inner splines of the clutch hub were broken off and floating around in my primary housing. The clutch hub/broken spline problem was a somewhat common problem others were having too. Evidence of the weak compensators became apparent when ordering the Harley suggested SE upgrade compensator. They were on back order. I also had to order a new clutch hub to replace the damaged one.
I believe the main cause of these issue is the auto-tensioner. It adjusts itself as tight as a piano string, and creates havoc for the rest of the drive components.
I talked to 2 Harley mechanics at 2 different Harley dealerships, and they both told me that if I didn't change out my weak compensator, it could cause catastrophic failure of my primary drive components and more. I know now that, that was only part of the problem.
After installing the new SE upgrade compensator, and the new clutch hub, I still wasn't confident I had corrected the issues, with the way the drive sounded and the bike performed.
That's when I realized the tensioner was the culprit. I decided to alter my auto tensioner from auto to manually adjustable. I didn't really want to spend an additional $200 to purchase a Baker manual adjuster. (I decided from research and reading blogs, that this was a good one) The factory auto tensioner has good components, so with a little time and about $1.50, it seems to be functioning just fine, and much of the whirring sound is gone.
Sorry for being so long winded here, but felt the need to share my experience. I'm somewhat disheartened by my Harley experience, especially when Harley hasn't ponied up to remedy this issue. They're more than willing to sell you new parts though.
Last edited by William Olson; 09-08-2017 at 01:42 AM. Reason: Text change
#36
Recently had primary drive issues. Seems my problems are shared by many.
I read a number of blogs on here pertaining to issues in the stock primary drive system, to include the compensator, clutch hub, and auto tensioner.
Upon inspection, (removing the primary cover) I discovered damage to the compensator, and clutch hub.
Evidently, from reading a number of blogs, and talking to other Harley owners and mechanics, Harley installed weak compensators in their '07-'11 96 c.i. twin cams. To complicate matters, the auto tensioner gets so tight, it causes premature failure of the transmission output side bearing, etc. Also, when removing the compensator and clutch, (you have to remove both at the same time) I discovered another problem. Roughly 3/8"-1/2" of the inner splines of the clutch hub were broken off and floating around in my primary housing. The clutch hub/broken spline problem was a somewhat common problem others were having too. Evidence of the weak compensators became apparent when ordering the Harley suggested SE upgrade compensator. They were on back order. I also had to order a new clutch hub to replace the damaged one.
I believe the main cause of these issue is the auto-tensioner. It adjusts itself as tight as a piano string, and crestes havoc for the rest of the drive components.
I talked to 2 Harley mechanics at 2 different Harley dealerships, and they both told me that if I didn't change out my weak compensator, it could cause catastrophic failure of my primary drive components and more. I know now that, that was only part of the problem.
After installing the new SE upgrade compensator, and the new clutch hub, I still wasn't confident I had corrected the issues, with the way the drive sounded and the bike performed.
That's when I realized the tensioner was the culprit. I decided to alter my auto tensioner from auto to manual. I didn't really want to spend an additional $200 to purchase a Baker manual adjuster. (I decided from research and reading blogs, that this was a good one) The factory auto tensioner has good components, so with a little time and about $1.50, it seems to be functioning just fine, and much of the whirring sound is gone.
Sorry for being so long winded here, but felt the need to share my experience. I'm somewhat disheartened by my Harley experience, especially when Harley hasn't ponied up to remedy this issue. They're more than willing to sell you new parts though.
I read a number of blogs on here pertaining to issues in the stock primary drive system, to include the compensator, clutch hub, and auto tensioner.
Upon inspection, (removing the primary cover) I discovered damage to the compensator, and clutch hub.
Evidently, from reading a number of blogs, and talking to other Harley owners and mechanics, Harley installed weak compensators in their '07-'11 96 c.i. twin cams. To complicate matters, the auto tensioner gets so tight, it causes premature failure of the transmission output side bearing, etc. Also, when removing the compensator and clutch, (you have to remove both at the same time) I discovered another problem. Roughly 3/8"-1/2" of the inner splines of the clutch hub were broken off and floating around in my primary housing. The clutch hub/broken spline problem was a somewhat common problem others were having too. Evidence of the weak compensators became apparent when ordering the Harley suggested SE upgrade compensator. They were on back order. I also had to order a new clutch hub to replace the damaged one.
I believe the main cause of these issue is the auto-tensioner. It adjusts itself as tight as a piano string, and crestes havoc for the rest of the drive components.
I talked to 2 Harley mechanics at 2 different Harley dealerships, and they both told me that if I didn't change out my weak compensator, it could cause catastrophic failure of my primary drive components and more. I know now that, that was only part of the problem.
After installing the new SE upgrade compensator, and the new clutch hub, I still wasn't confident I had corrected the issues, with the way the drive sounded and the bike performed.
That's when I realized the tensioner was the culprit. I decided to alter my auto tensioner from auto to manual. I didn't really want to spend an additional $200 to purchase a Baker manual adjuster. (I decided from research and reading blogs, that this was a good one) The factory auto tensioner has good components, so with a little time and about $1.50, it seems to be functioning just fine, and much of the whirring sound is gone.
Sorry for being so long winded here, but felt the need to share my experience. I'm somewhat disheartened by my Harley experience, especially when Harley hasn't ponied up to remedy this issue. They're more than willing to sell you new parts though.
#37
I modified the original auto tensioner in such a manner as to keep it simple and reuseable if I desired to revert back to the original design. It is now adjustable but unfortunately you need to remove the tensioner to adjust.
The "floating" wedge assembly is still spring loaded with the original spring. I was hoping I could remove the wedge/ramp without removing the whole tensioner assembly, but that didn't work as I'd hoped. Still, quite simple to remove and replace the whole assembly. Be careful to reinstall the spacers behind the tensioner, and use appropriate thread locker when doing this.
I went to my local hardware store on a Sunday, and purchased the parts needed to modify the original assembly. My purchase included a 4" SS 8-24 screw and matching ny-lock nut. The reason I chose this size and length, is, it needed to fit into the orginal hole in the ramp/wedge assembly, and be able to put the orginal spring back on it. I removed the small retainer on the spring loaded plunger/ramp assembly rod. Much to my surprise, the small rod which the spring covered was PLASTIC!
I then notched out the forward end of the wedge/ramp, with a grinder and cutting wheel, to accept and hold the ny-lock nut to prevent the nut from spinning and loosing the adjustment made. On the head of the screw, I tack welded a crown nut, (and you can use whatever is handy or preferable) to form the "notch" similar to that on the end of the original plastic rod, which fits over the roll pin on the original assembly. Adjustments are made by turning the newly fabricated spring/plunger rod/screw in or out. I found that when adjusted to 5/8" of play cold, (1/8" of that play is realized in the "cushion" built into the original ramp, which is nice) I still have MUCH adjustment if needed in the future.
I should have taken a few more pictures with the spring on the screw, but at the time this was just a trial modification. The picture doesn't show the spring on the screw, or the newly fabricated "notch" at the "head" of the screw, but you get the idea. The newly fabricated assembly is spring loaded as the original, but will not ramp forward on it's own any more.
I've only put about 100 miles on my bike since the modification, and so far am happy with the results, and performance. It's quieter, and smoother, now that I have the proper slack in my drive chain.
I would like to mention that using a SS screw may be of possible concern as to the inherent properties of SS. SS is prone to cracking under conditions of vibration, and wonder if this may have been the reason for the plastic rod in the original design, but may not be an issue. Just my thoughts.
Use your own discretion if attempting to follow the design I'm posting here.
. If any of this is confusing or unclear, please ask questions.
The "floating" wedge assembly is still spring loaded with the original spring. I was hoping I could remove the wedge/ramp without removing the whole tensioner assembly, but that didn't work as I'd hoped. Still, quite simple to remove and replace the whole assembly. Be careful to reinstall the spacers behind the tensioner, and use appropriate thread locker when doing this.
I went to my local hardware store on a Sunday, and purchased the parts needed to modify the original assembly. My purchase included a 4" SS 8-24 screw and matching ny-lock nut. The reason I chose this size and length, is, it needed to fit into the orginal hole in the ramp/wedge assembly, and be able to put the orginal spring back on it. I removed the small retainer on the spring loaded plunger/ramp assembly rod. Much to my surprise, the small rod which the spring covered was PLASTIC!
I then notched out the forward end of the wedge/ramp, with a grinder and cutting wheel, to accept and hold the ny-lock nut to prevent the nut from spinning and loosing the adjustment made. On the head of the screw, I tack welded a crown nut, (and you can use whatever is handy or preferable) to form the "notch" similar to that on the end of the original plastic rod, which fits over the roll pin on the original assembly. Adjustments are made by turning the newly fabricated spring/plunger rod/screw in or out. I found that when adjusted to 5/8" of play cold, (1/8" of that play is realized in the "cushion" built into the original ramp, which is nice) I still have MUCH adjustment if needed in the future.
I should have taken a few more pictures with the spring on the screw, but at the time this was just a trial modification. The picture doesn't show the spring on the screw, or the newly fabricated "notch" at the "head" of the screw, but you get the idea. The newly fabricated assembly is spring loaded as the original, but will not ramp forward on it's own any more.
I've only put about 100 miles on my bike since the modification, and so far am happy with the results, and performance. It's quieter, and smoother, now that I have the proper slack in my drive chain.
I would like to mention that using a SS screw may be of possible concern as to the inherent properties of SS. SS is prone to cracking under conditions of vibration, and wonder if this may have been the reason for the plastic rod in the original design, but may not be an issue. Just my thoughts.
Use your own discretion if attempting to follow the design I'm posting here.
. If any of this is confusing or unclear, please ask questions.
Last edited by William Olson; 09-08-2017 at 01:30 AM. Reason: Edit text
The following users liked this post:
roadkillvespa (05-07-2022)
#38
I modified the original auto tensioner in such a manner as to keep it simple and useable if I desired to revert back to the original design. It is now adjustable but unfortunately you need to remove the tensioner to adjust.
The "floating" wedge assembly is still spring loaded with the original spring. I was hoping I could remove the wedge/ramp without removing the whole tensioner assembly, but that didn't work out. Still, quite simple to remove and replace. Be careful to reinstall the spacers behind the tensioner, and use appropriate thread locker when doing this.
I went to my local hardware store on a Sunday, and purchased the parts needed to modify the original assembly. My purchase included a 4" SS 8-24 screw and matching ny-lock nut. I removed the small retainer on the spring loaded plunger/ramp assembly. Much to my surprise, the small rod which the spring covered was PLASTIC!
I then notched out the forward end of the wedge/ramp, with a grinder and cutting wheel, to accept and hold the ny-lock nut to prevent the nut from spinning and loosing the adjustment made. On the head of the screw, I tack welded a crown nut, (and you can use whatever is handy or preferable) to form the "notch" similar to that on the end of the original plastic rod, which fits over the roll pin on the original assembly. Adjustments are made by turning the newly fabricated spring/plunger rod/screw in or out. I found that when adjusted to 5/8" of play cold, (1/8" of that play is realized in the "cushion" built into the original ramp, which is nice) When adjusted to "spec", I still have MUCH adjustment if needed in the future.
I should have taken a few more pictures with the spring on the screw, but at the time this was just a trial modification. The picture doesn't show the spring on the screw, or the newly fabricated "notch" at the "head" of the screw, but you get the idea.
I've only put about 100 miles on my bike since the modification, but so far am happy with the results, and performance.
I would like to mention that using a SS screw may be of possible concern as to the inherent properties of SS. SS is prone to cracking under conditions of vibration, and wonder if this may have been the reason for the plastic rod in the original design, but may not be an issue. Just my thoughts.
Use your own discretion if attempting to follow the design I'm posting here.
The "floating" wedge assembly is still spring loaded with the original spring. I was hoping I could remove the wedge/ramp without removing the whole tensioner assembly, but that didn't work out. Still, quite simple to remove and replace. Be careful to reinstall the spacers behind the tensioner, and use appropriate thread locker when doing this.
I went to my local hardware store on a Sunday, and purchased the parts needed to modify the original assembly. My purchase included a 4" SS 8-24 screw and matching ny-lock nut. I removed the small retainer on the spring loaded plunger/ramp assembly. Much to my surprise, the small rod which the spring covered was PLASTIC!
I then notched out the forward end of the wedge/ramp, with a grinder and cutting wheel, to accept and hold the ny-lock nut to prevent the nut from spinning and loosing the adjustment made. On the head of the screw, I tack welded a crown nut, (and you can use whatever is handy or preferable) to form the "notch" similar to that on the end of the original plastic rod, which fits over the roll pin on the original assembly. Adjustments are made by turning the newly fabricated spring/plunger rod/screw in or out. I found that when adjusted to 5/8" of play cold, (1/8" of that play is realized in the "cushion" built into the original ramp, which is nice) When adjusted to "spec", I still have MUCH adjustment if needed in the future.
I should have taken a few more pictures with the spring on the screw, but at the time this was just a trial modification. The picture doesn't show the spring on the screw, or the newly fabricated "notch" at the "head" of the screw, but you get the idea.
I've only put about 100 miles on my bike since the modification, but so far am happy with the results, and performance.
I would like to mention that using a SS screw may be of possible concern as to the inherent properties of SS. SS is prone to cracking under conditions of vibration, and wonder if this may have been the reason for the plastic rod in the original design, but may not be an issue. Just my thoughts.
Use your own discretion if attempting to follow the design I'm posting here.
#39
Auto primary chain adjuster
NOTE!
The magic marker lines indicate the internal spring stop, so I didn't cut too deep. The original spring is located on the long threaded portion of the screw. . (Not pictured) Also, the "notch" I mentioned on the head of the screw isnt in the photo either. Sorry, but you get the idea. The reason for going this far into the shoe, is to give you more adjustment travel for the screw, and ALSO, to accomodate the original spring length.
NOTE AGAIN, the magic marker lines to indicate the spring stop so I didn't cut too deep.
The magic marker lines indicate the internal spring stop, so I didn't cut too deep. The original spring is located on the long threaded portion of the screw. . (Not pictured) Also, the "notch" I mentioned on the head of the screw isnt in the photo either. Sorry, but you get the idea. The reason for going this far into the shoe, is to give you more adjustment travel for the screw, and ALSO, to accomodate the original spring length.
NOTE AGAIN, the magic marker lines to indicate the spring stop so I didn't cut too deep.
Last edited by William Olson; 09-08-2017 at 10:53 AM. Reason: Edit text
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