Our first ever DOT helmet police stop.... yep
#71
05-02-2011, 07:22 AM
Outstanding HDF Member
Just a sampling of an article I found.....
http://www.cyrilhuzeblog.com/2009/09...t-helmet-laws/
The responses are lenghty but worth reading.
DOT can not approve helmets. Therefore no helmets are approved by DOT.
NTSB......laws require motorcyclists to wear helmets compliant with the federal motorcycle helmet performance standard, FMVSS 218.
http://www.cyrilhuzeblog.com/2009/09...t-helmet-laws/
The responses are lenghty but worth reading.
DOT can not approve helmets. Therefore no helmets are approved by DOT.
NTSB......laws require motorcyclists to wear helmets compliant with the federal motorcycle helmet performance standard, FMVSS 218.
Some people are splitting hairs when they claim a difference between NTSB and DOT.
The former is a division of the latter.
It reminds me of the people who claim the IRS is illegal.
#72
05-02-2011, 07:26 AM
Seasoned HDF Member
Thanks for laying out all the rules for us, should really simplify my life. Oh, since you're the guy signing my paycheck, I'm tired of no raises for the past 4 years, I need a raise please.
I just gotta flame this.....
Public harrassment and revenue gathering like this are NOT what I pay cops to do, nor do I pay them to violate constitutional rights by forcing people from their homes as they did here recently illegaly, nor to harrass bikers or anyone else, or set up speed traps to bring in 200K a day as they do here also. Yeh, I don't like cops - WTF!!!
I do pay them to control traffic when necessary by getting their butts into the street and do some directing to avoid wrecks. I do pay them to pull over people in SUV's yacking mindlessly on the phone who are a PUBLIC menice like the one who turned left barely infront of me never looking in any direction, I do pay them to at least attempt to deter crimes against the public, bust crack houses (which they seldom do), chase down and apprehend rapests, child molesters, armed robbers, criminals who assault women and senior citizens, etc.
I do not pay them for pulling over folks cause they don't like your helmet, it should be none of their business if you even wear one, or they dont like the pipes on your scoot, or any of the dozens of other offensive cop activites they regularaly do which are not crimes against either individuals or the public. They are public servents and I, like TINKER1, wish they'd attend to the jobs the're not doing, don't care for what they mostly are doing, and sure don't care for people who dont know the difference between chicken s_ _t harrassment of basically law abiding, tax paying citizens and real crime.
Yeh, I'd write my rep also, or better yet go to his office and pay him a visit as I have done before. Thats what they are there for. Thats WTF.
Public harrassment and revenue gathering like this are NOT what I pay cops to do, nor do I pay them to violate constitutional rights by forcing people from their homes as they did here recently illegaly, nor to harrass bikers or anyone else, or set up speed traps to bring in 200K a day as they do here also. Yeh, I don't like cops - WTF!!!
I do pay them to control traffic when necessary by getting their butts into the street and do some directing to avoid wrecks. I do pay them to pull over people in SUV's yacking mindlessly on the phone who are a PUBLIC menice like the one who turned left barely infront of me never looking in any direction, I do pay them to at least attempt to deter crimes against the public, bust crack houses (which they seldom do), chase down and apprehend rapests, child molesters, armed robbers, criminals who assault women and senior citizens, etc.
I do not pay them for pulling over folks cause they don't like your helmet, it should be none of their business if you even wear one, or they dont like the pipes on your scoot, or any of the dozens of other offensive cop activites they regularaly do which are not crimes against either individuals or the public. They are public servents and I, like TINKER1, wish they'd attend to the jobs the're not doing, don't care for what they mostly are doing, and sure don't care for people who dont know the difference between chicken s_ _t harrassment of basically law abiding, tax paying citizens and real crime.
Yeh, I'd write my rep also, or better yet go to his office and pay him a visit as I have done before. Thats what they are there for. Thats WTF.
#73
05-02-2011, 07:46 AM
Ultimate HDF Member
quit your pissing and moaning. you live in a state where the majority of the citizens...thru their elected officials...want you to wear a d.o.t. approved helmet to protect you. move to another state that does not have a helmet law-of course, you will find something there you don't like either.
the real solution would be to get involved in the political process...find a candidate that agrees with you and give him your support. that would entail more than just showing up on election day. volunteer at his campaign office, put his campaign signs in your yard and his stickers on your vehicles, go door-to-door and ask your fellow citizens for their support, work the phone banks, and of course write a check to help him with his expenses.
and the OP is a lawyer? what a bunch of bleeding-heart liberals! and then he has the nerve to complain when his little feelings get hurt...he should turn in his a.c.l.u. card. or he could run for public office--aren't most of the crooks in the state capitals lawyers? he could campaign on getting the helmet law repealled...he would have plenty of campaign funds and supporters from the "biker" community. lol.
the real solution would be to get involved in the political process...find a candidate that agrees with you and give him your support. that would entail more than just showing up on election day. volunteer at his campaign office, put his campaign signs in your yard and his stickers on your vehicles, go door-to-door and ask your fellow citizens for their support, work the phone banks, and of course write a check to help him with his expenses.
and the OP is a lawyer? what a bunch of bleeding-heart liberals! and then he has the nerve to complain when his little feelings get hurt...he should turn in his a.c.l.u. card. or he could run for public office--aren't most of the crooks in the state capitals lawyers? he could campaign on getting the helmet law repealled...he would have plenty of campaign funds and supporters from the "biker" community. lol.
#75
05-02-2011, 08:32 AM
and the OP is a lawyer? what a bunch of bleeding-heart liberals! and then he has the nerve to complain when his little feelings get hurt...he should turn in his a.c.l.u. card. or he could run for public office--aren't most of the crooks in the state capitals lawyers? he could campaign on getting the helmet law repealled...he would have plenty of campaign funds and supporters from the "biker" community. lol.
#76
05-02-2011, 09:08 AM
Ultimate HDF Member
bikerlaw-while we are at it, let's pass one more law. no more licenses to practice law to be issued...too many already. when one lawyer retires or dies then issue a new license to one. the officer was enforcing the law--that is what the taxpayers want. you are not above the law and should applaud the officer for doing his job. being inconvienced is part of living in a free society.
#77
05-02-2011, 09:24 AM
Oh, the Lawyer bashing goes on and on.................
Since you clearly missed it in the many posts. I WAS wearing a DOT helmet as was Mike, the other Lawyer. Remember, he was the one that was stopped. I pulled over with him out of courtesy to my buddy. Neither one of us was breaking the law, and both of us were sent on our way after only a brief delay. This post was intended to alert others who actively choose to not comply with the DOT mandate, that they may have issues here in Virginia. Try to keep up son.
Since you clearly missed it in the many posts. I WAS wearing a DOT helmet as was Mike, the other Lawyer. Remember, he was the one that was stopped. I pulled over with him out of courtesy to my buddy. Neither one of us was breaking the law, and both of us were sent on our way after only a brief delay. This post was intended to alert others who actively choose to not comply with the DOT mandate, that they may have issues here in Virginia. Try to keep up son.
Last edited by bikerlaw; 05-02-2011 at 09:28 AM.
#78
05-02-2011, 09:31 AM
+1 for a rev gen thing. Most states are hurting for money and tickets are a fast and easy way to get it. I just hate the fact that they use LEOs to do the job of making up the short fall for the idiots who can not spend the states money in a responsable way to begin with. Most LEOs I know do not like it either. Expect more of the same for ANY mode of personal transportation that you use.
#79
05-02-2011, 12:07 PM
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BikerLaw - Thanks for the head's up about the helmet check. I get down that way often and have never seen them do this before either. Hopefully this was a one time thing because of the VA Beach event.
Don't let the comprehension skills of some of the posters get you down. Once threads start going over two pages a lot of folks glaze over, check out, and just reply to whatever they read last, completely neglecting the original intent of the post.
Thanks again!
Don't let the comprehension skills of some of the posters get you down. Once threads start going over two pages a lot of folks glaze over, check out, and just reply to whatever they read last, completely neglecting the original intent of the post.
Thanks again!
#80
05-02-2011, 12:52 PM
Heres a heads up. I just got this e-mail.
__________________________________________________ ______
From: matt@motorcyclelawgroup.com
Date: Mon, 2 May 2011 12:01:23 -0400
Subject: Tickets Issued at Virginia Beach Bike Classic
The Virginia Beach Bike Classic was held this weekend at North Beach landing in Virginia Beach, Virginia. It was great to be there and see a lot of friends from Virginia and the Carolinas. However the event was marred by law enforcement. The Virginia State Police in conjunction with the Virginia Beach Police Department set up a few miles from the event and wrote tickets for offenses such as unapproved helmets, illegal exhausts, improperly mounted license plates, etc. It was reported at one point that they were refusing those without a “DOT Approved” helmet to proceed further and forced them to go back to the event a buy a new helmet.
If you or anyone that you know received such a ticket at the Virginia Beach Bike Classic please contact me and I will represent you at no charge. These charges are improper given the law in Virginia. For those in favor of mandatory helmet use this is not an attack on helmets. I respect the right of every motorcyclist to hold an opinion on this matter. However this is not about helmets, it is about ensuring that the police follow the law. If they are going to stop and charge people they should at least be familiar with the statutes under which they are charging them.
I also want to reiterate that I am not anti-law enforcement. As an ex police officer and an ex prosecuting attorney I have an extensive law enforcement background. However, to many times I see motorcyclists charged for not wearing a helmet approved by DOT when the law in Virginia does not require that a helmet be approved by anyone. I also see tickets for illegal exhausts merely because the officer does not like the sound of the exhaust. I have seen tickets for improperly mounted license plates merely because the license plate is mounted vertically instead of horizontally. Virginia law does not prohibit vertically mounted license plates. I have even seen a few handle bar height tickets when that law was repealed in 2003. You are not guilty of an offense simply because an officer says that you are. You are only guilty if you have violated a statute or ordinance. A great number of people charged at the Virginia Beach Bike Classic did not violate any state or local law.
That is why I think it is important to challenge these tickets even though they are non-moving violations. If we as motorcyclists merely pre-pay them because it is too much of a hassle to go to court and fight then we will continue to receive improperly issued tickets. So if you have received such a ticket please contact me and I will be happy to take the case(s) at no charge.
Matt Danielson
McGrath & Danielson
Tom McGrath's Motorcycle Law Group
1-800-321-8968
Motorcyclelawgroup.com
__________________________________________________ ______
From: matt@motorcyclelawgroup.com
Date: Mon, 2 May 2011 12:01:23 -0400
Subject: Tickets Issued at Virginia Beach Bike Classic
The Virginia Beach Bike Classic was held this weekend at North Beach landing in Virginia Beach, Virginia. It was great to be there and see a lot of friends from Virginia and the Carolinas. However the event was marred by law enforcement. The Virginia State Police in conjunction with the Virginia Beach Police Department set up a few miles from the event and wrote tickets for offenses such as unapproved helmets, illegal exhausts, improperly mounted license plates, etc. It was reported at one point that they were refusing those without a “DOT Approved” helmet to proceed further and forced them to go back to the event a buy a new helmet.
If you or anyone that you know received such a ticket at the Virginia Beach Bike Classic please contact me and I will represent you at no charge. These charges are improper given the law in Virginia. For those in favor of mandatory helmet use this is not an attack on helmets. I respect the right of every motorcyclist to hold an opinion on this matter. However this is not about helmets, it is about ensuring that the police follow the law. If they are going to stop and charge people they should at least be familiar with the statutes under which they are charging them.
I also want to reiterate that I am not anti-law enforcement. As an ex police officer and an ex prosecuting attorney I have an extensive law enforcement background. However, to many times I see motorcyclists charged for not wearing a helmet approved by DOT when the law in Virginia does not require that a helmet be approved by anyone. I also see tickets for illegal exhausts merely because the officer does not like the sound of the exhaust. I have seen tickets for improperly mounted license plates merely because the license plate is mounted vertically instead of horizontally. Virginia law does not prohibit vertically mounted license plates. I have even seen a few handle bar height tickets when that law was repealed in 2003. You are not guilty of an offense simply because an officer says that you are. You are only guilty if you have violated a statute or ordinance. A great number of people charged at the Virginia Beach Bike Classic did not violate any state or local law.
That is why I think it is important to challenge these tickets even though they are non-moving violations. If we as motorcyclists merely pre-pay them because it is too much of a hassle to go to court and fight then we will continue to receive improperly issued tickets. So if you have received such a ticket please contact me and I will be happy to take the case(s) at no charge.
Matt Danielson
McGrath & Danielson
Tom McGrath's Motorcycle Law Group
1-800-321-8968
Motorcyclelawgroup.com