So, a few questions on SE air filter and jetting...
#1
09-11-2009 | 10:31 AM
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From: USA
So, a few questions on SE air filter and jetting...
So, I'm trying to figure out what I have on this new(to me) Fatboy.
The previous owner has changed the air filter to a SE and removed the plastic(?) backing from the OE filter cover as I assume you would. But from what I've read, re-jetting should have been done so not to run lean.
Now my questions:
1) Is this something that is commonly done at the time the new filter set up is installed?
2) If it has been done, do I still need to re-jet if I put V&H Double Barrel pipes on or is this the same jet kit that would be used for V&H pipes and I'm good to go?
The big question is:
3) How can I tell if this has been done?
The previous owner has changed the air filter to a SE and removed the plastic(?) backing from the OE filter cover as I assume you would. But from what I've read, re-jetting should have been done so not to run lean.
Now my questions:
1) Is this something that is commonly done at the time the new filter set up is installed?
2) If it has been done, do I still need to re-jet if I put V&H Double Barrel pipes on or is this the same jet kit that would be used for V&H pipes and I'm good to go?
The big question is:
3) How can I tell if this has been done?
#2
09-11-2009 | 12:51 PM
R.I.P. BROTHER
Joined: Dec 2008
Posts: 3,076
Likes: 4
From: Colorado Springs
Its amazing how Jetting is suddenly a lost art amongst the Intra'net savvy Harley elite.
You need to go richer. Ther easiest way to determine what jetting you should have in yer' part of the country as a high altitude setting is different from a guy in say...Florida is to check with your local Harley dealers service dept and ask then how you should jet for whatever it is you have added.....Or wanna add.
The jets are marked with the sizes. The only way to know whats in there...Is to get in there and pull em' and check em.
I was a jetting guru on my last bike. An Evo Heritage. Now I'm just another EFI fvcktard and have forgotten the fine art of proper jetting and carb adjustering!!
You need to go richer. Ther easiest way to determine what jetting you should have in yer' part of the country as a high altitude setting is different from a guy in say...Florida is to check with your local Harley dealers service dept and ask then how you should jet for whatever it is you have added.....Or wanna add.
The jets are marked with the sizes. The only way to know whats in there...Is to get in there and pull em' and check em.
I was a jetting guru on my last bike. An Evo Heritage. Now I'm just another EFI fvcktard and have forgotten the fine art of proper jetting and carb adjustering!!
#3
09-11-2009 | 01:42 PM
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From: USA
Its amazing how Jetting is suddenly a lost art amongst the Intra'net savvy Harley elite.
You need to go richer. Ther easiest way to determine what jetting you should have in yer' part of the country as a high altitude setting is different from a guy in say...Florida is to check with your local Harley dealers service dept and ask then how you should jet for whatever it is you have added.....Or wanna add.
The jets are marked with the sizes. The only way to know whats in there...Is to get in there and pull em' and check em.
I was a jetting guru on my last bike. An Evo Heritage. Now I'm just another EFI fvcktard and have forgotten the fine art of proper jetting and carb adjustering!!
You need to go richer. Ther easiest way to determine what jetting you should have in yer' part of the country as a high altitude setting is different from a guy in say...Florida is to check with your local Harley dealers service dept and ask then how you should jet for whatever it is you have added.....Or wanna add.
The jets are marked with the sizes. The only way to know whats in there...Is to get in there and pull em' and check em.
I was a jetting guru on my last bike. An Evo Heritage. Now I'm just another EFI fvcktard and have forgotten the fine art of proper jetting and carb adjustering!!
Funny you mention EFI. I was looking for EFI Fatboy's as a first priority and my Bro in law says, "you would prob. rather have carbed, they sound better". He has an 06 Ultra and misses his carbed Heritage's sound. I'm thinking, how can it possibly sound different...but it really does. I love it! Much better, low idle...less *managed* and just pure mechanical I guess.
This 2003 came along with 1300 miles and was carbed, so I made the exception from my wants and based on his comment and the miles on it, I jumped on it. No regrets!
Thanks for the reply Chaz!
#4
09-11-2009 | 02:10 PM
R.I.P. BROTHER
Joined: Dec 2008
Posts: 3,076
Likes: 4
From: Colorado Springs
[quote]
I guess I meant that ading an AC calls for more fuel....I should have clarifiyed that stock jetting would be on the lean side when paired with the SE AC.
My air at 6000 feet above sea-level is thinner than your air. Hence i jet leaner than you do at sea-level. So for example on my ****** dirtbike when I go down to Texas and ride I have to swap out jets or it will run lean and sieze. If I leve those same jets in and come back up to 6-8000 feet above sea-level it will be so sloppy rich I'll foul plugs all day and run like chit.
Nope.
Assumption sucks when dealing with ones pride and joy and the quest for maximium power output!
.
Pull them and see whats in there...Gotta a service manual?
I would anyway. Piece of mind is priceless!!
Profit trumps pride at times....
Funny you mention EFI. I was looking for EFI Fatboy's as a first priority and my Bro in law says, "you would prob. rather have carbed, they sound better". He has an 06 Ultra and misses his carbed Heritage's sound. I'm thinking, how can it possibly sound different...but it really does. I love it! Much better, low idle...less *managed* and just pure mechanical I guess.
The carbs bikes idle sound is better. I try not to sit around idling for long. I like riding better. My deal is the altitude. I cant be rejetting a bike riding down to New mexico and the EFI runs better up at my altitude its seamless and almost idiot proof asssuming a good tuner has had his way with it!!
I concur. Get it right and ride the dawgshit outta it!!
Thanks for joining team Sloptail!!
I'm no guru but do understand the reason for changing jets and what geo location has to do with it but I guess,
I'm wanting to know if anything on the outside of the carb would indicate they'd been in there.
If it looks like they have (how to tell is one of my questions), then more than likely they are the correct jets for the SE filter.
And if so, is that the right ones for a upgraded V&H exhaust
Pull them and see whats in there...Gotta a service manual?
I have an email into my sales guy to find out what was done, IF they sold it new. If not, I will prob. have to take it in and let them look it over.
Apparently they don't look into things too much with trade in bikes. Two weeks after I bought it, I had a short in the headlight system...I found it...badly spliced headlight pigtail grounding on the headlight bezel. The previous owner must have had a new style head light or something they removed before trading/selling and halfa**ed the re-connection.
Funny you mention EFI. I was looking for EFI Fatboy's as a first priority and my Bro in law says, "you would prob. rather have carbed, they sound better". He has an 06 Ultra and misses his carbed Heritage's sound. I'm thinking, how can it possibly sound different...but it really does. I love it! Much better, low idle...less *managed* and just pure mechanical I guess.
The carbs bikes idle sound is better. I try not to sit around idling for long. I like riding better. My deal is the altitude. I cant be rejetting a bike riding down to New mexico and the EFI runs better up at my altitude its seamless and almost idiot proof asssuming a good tuner has had his way with it!!
This 2003 came along with 1300 miles and was carbed, so I made the exception from my wants and based on his comment and the miles on it, I jumped on it. No regrets!
Thanks for the reply Chaz!
#5
09-11-2009 | 02:49 PM
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From: USA
Got a reply back from my dealer telling me it does have the SE filter (which they told me was stock when I asked the day I bought it because I suspected it was not stock...I figured out on my own before now that it was a SE) and they changed the slow jet to a .48 for the SE air filter (not too sure of what the slow jet is...is there 2 jets?) Also, if I went with V&H pipes, I should go with the Dynojet kit (which I plan to do). Actually I am thinking of going with the thunder slide kit but that's neither here nor there.
So, if I can believe them it has been tuned for the SE AF. These guys told me the day I looked at the bike they were tracing a wire from the bars to under the tank and it would be ready to test ride the next day. When I had the short, I called to ask what they were tracing only to be told they didn't do anything electrical while in the service dept. and stuck to the story even after I reminded them about that day in the shop. Then when I found the problem, called them on it only to be told they replaced the start switch and nothing to do with the headlight. Funny how the story changes and last I checked, that's electrical. I think they had the same short and didn't find what I did or found it and left it as is thinking that wasn't it. It was a very tiny wire poking out from a crappy solder job through a poorly done heat shrink job.
I'm prob. going to take it to my even closer dealer to check things out to be sure of what I actually have.
Thanks for the replies and letting me vent Chaz!
So, if I can believe them it has been tuned for the SE AF. These guys told me the day I looked at the bike they were tracing a wire from the bars to under the tank and it would be ready to test ride the next day. When I had the short, I called to ask what they were tracing only to be told they didn't do anything electrical while in the service dept. and stuck to the story even after I reminded them about that day in the shop. Then when I found the problem, called them on it only to be told they replaced the start switch and nothing to do with the headlight. Funny how the story changes and last I checked, that's electrical. I think they had the same short and didn't find what I did or found it and left it as is thinking that wasn't it. It was a very tiny wire poking out from a crappy solder job through a poorly done heat shrink job.
I'm prob. going to take it to my even closer dealer to check things out to be sure of what I actually have.
Thanks for the replies and letting me vent Chaz!
Last edited by centennialfatboy; 09-11-2009 at 02:51 PM.
#6
09-11-2009 | 02:59 PM
R.I.P. BROTHER
Joined: Dec 2008
Posts: 3,076
Likes: 4
From: Colorado Springs
[QUOTE]
If the dealer put the Air Filter in the bike typically they will rejet. Rejet means more money charged to the customer....No reason to skip that step!
Get yer' hands dirty and fix the fvcker yourself!!
Go ride the thing!!
Got a reply back from my dealer telling me it does have the SE filter (which they told me was stock when I asked the day I bought it because I suspected it was not stock...I figured out on my own before now that it was a SE) and they changed the slow jet to a .48 for the SE air filter (not too sure of what the slow jet is...is there 2 jets?) Also, if I went with V&H pipes, I should go with the Dynojet kit (which I plan to do). Actually I am thinking of going with the thunder slide kit but that's neither here nor there.
So, if I can believe them it has been tuned for the SE AF. These guys told me the day I looked at the bike they were tracing a wire from the bars to under the tank and it would be ready to test ride the next day. When I had the short, I called to ask what they were tracing only to be told they didn't do anything electrical while in the service dept. and stuck to the story even after I reminded them about that day in the shop. Then when I found the problem, called them on it only to be told they replaced the start switch and nothing to do with the headlight. Funny how the story changes and last I checked, that's electrical. I think they had the same short and didn't find what I did or found it and left it as is thinking that wasn't it. It was a very tiny wire poking out from a crappy solder job through a poorly done heat shrink job.
I'm prob. going to take it to my even closer dealer to check things out to be sure of what I actually have.
Thanks for the replies and letting me vent Chaz!
Thanks for the replies and letting me vent Chaz!
#7
09-11-2009 | 03:00 PM
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Joined: May 2007
Posts: 96
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From: Oahu
Assuming it is a stock CV-40, you can look at the bottom of the carb where the air mixture screw should be. It comes plugged from the factory. If it is plugged then the carb was not adjusted and likely the jets were not changed. If it is unplugged and you can get to the adjustment screw or if they added an easy adjust screw then you can assume something was done to the carb. If so, you may want to pull the carb to determine if the jets were changed out.
As stated, your carb adjustment could vary by altitude. For an SE Filter at sea level with less restrictive than stock pipes (not open drag pipes) you would likely be OK with the stock 45 slow jet and 190 main jet. A 46 slow jet should work well too. Air mixture screw adjustment is made to best idle at @ 900-1100 rpm. There are more detailed procedures dialing in the carb at each 1/4 throttle setting by plug reading. However, if you aren't blowing black smoke out the back, having detonation issues, glowing plugs, bluing pipes, gas coming out the exhaust, heavy gas fumes or other issues then the stock set-up with air/fuel mixture adjusted to good idle should be OK.
As stated, your carb adjustment could vary by altitude. For an SE Filter at sea level with less restrictive than stock pipes (not open drag pipes) you would likely be OK with the stock 45 slow jet and 190 main jet. A 46 slow jet should work well too. Air mixture screw adjustment is made to best idle at @ 900-1100 rpm. There are more detailed procedures dialing in the carb at each 1/4 throttle setting by plug reading. However, if you aren't blowing black smoke out the back, having detonation issues, glowing plugs, bluing pipes, gas coming out the exhaust, heavy gas fumes or other issues then the stock set-up with air/fuel mixture adjusted to good idle should be OK.
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#8
09-11-2009 | 03:20 PM
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From: USA
Did...it's fixed. I'm not afraid of a little dirt or manual labor.
Everyday my friend...everyday...
#9
09-11-2009 | 03:27 PM
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From: USA
Assuming it is a stock CV-40, you can look at the bottom of the carb where the air mixture screw should be. It comes plugged from the factory. If it is plugged then the carb was not adjusted and likely the jets were not changed. If it is unplugged and you can get to the adjustment screw or if they added an easy adjust screw then you can assume something was done to the carb. If so, you may want to pull the carb to determine if the jets were changed out.
As stated, your carb adjustment could vary by altitude. For an SE Filter at sea level with less restrictive than stock pipes (not open drag pipes) you would likely be OK with the stock 45 slow jet and 190 main jet. A 46 slow jet should work well too. Air mixture screw adjustment is made to best idle at @ 900-1100 rpm. There are more detailed procedures dialing in the carb at each 1/4 throttle setting by plug reading. However, if you aren't blowing black smoke out the back, having detonation issues, glowing plugs, bluing pipes, gas coming out the exhaust, heavy gas fumes or other issues then the stock set-up with air/fuel mixture adjusted to good idle should be OK.
As stated, your carb adjustment could vary by altitude. For an SE Filter at sea level with less restrictive than stock pipes (not open drag pipes) you would likely be OK with the stock 45 slow jet and 190 main jet. A 46 slow jet should work well too. Air mixture screw adjustment is made to best idle at @ 900-1100 rpm. There are more detailed procedures dialing in the carb at each 1/4 throttle setting by plug reading. However, if you aren't blowing black smoke out the back, having detonation issues, glowing plugs, bluing pipes, gas coming out the exhaust, heavy gas fumes or other issues then the stock set-up with air/fuel mixture adjusted to good idle should be OK.
I'll look at the mixture screw this evening and see. That was one of my original questions, so thanks!
#10
09-11-2009 | 04:01 PM
Road Captain
Joined: Jun 2009
Posts: 717
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From: Drexel Hill, Pa
I haven't done Harleys but I have done alot of sport bikes and dirt bikes.
I would think it's the same. The spark plugs will tell you everything. Look for a coco brown color on your plugs. White is lean and black fouled is too rich. Along with the main jet and slow jet you have needle size and sometimes height adjustments on the needle. I always check my plugs color before I make any changes. I wish my Night Train had a carb. Don't need a dyno to tune.
I would think it's the same. The spark plugs will tell you everything. Look for a coco brown color on your plugs. White is lean and black fouled is too rich. Along with the main jet and slow jet you have needle size and sometimes height adjustments on the needle. I always check my plugs color before I make any changes. I wish my Night Train had a carb. Don't need a dyno to tune.