So What’s The Word On This New Engine Is It A Keeper Or A Dud ?
#11
11-20-2022, 10:44 PM
Club Member
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#12
11-20-2022, 11:13 PM
Grand HDF Member
That's not the way it's going to go though. Liquid cooled is almost certainly coming, but we've already had Steve Cole confirm that Harley is far from done with 45-degree big twins.
The Revolution Max has been stated as 500 to 1250cc. It will power the new Sportster line, and we will certainly see that line expand, possibly as early as January.
But the Rev Max is not the engine for a 900 lb bagger.
I expect a new generation of 45-degree Big Twin to power the next revamp of the touring bikes, with huge pistons, long strokes, low RPMs and at least some degree of water cooling. Something more like the Indian Challenger engine, although I would be shocked if it wasn't 45 degrees.
The Revolution Max is a high-RPM, high-horsepower engine. 150 hp at 9,000 RPM and peak torque of 94 ft/lbs at 6,750 RPM. That's not a touring bike engine, and that's not heritage and tradition. Compare that to the Indian. The Challenger is instead a low-RPM, high-torque engine. 122 hp at 5,500 RPM, 128 ft/lbs at 3,500 RPM. That performs like a Stage 4 M8. That's a touring bike engine.
The Rev Max is a highly over square engine, the bore is 1.46x as big as the stroke. The M8 is an undersquare design.
Summing it up: the Revolution Max is a great engine for high revving sporty bikes like Sportsters and Adventure bikes and sport-tourers. But for the touring bikes, yes, someday they will evolve toward liquid cooling, but I strongly doubt they will move to the Rev Max. Instead I expect something closer to the Twin-Cooled M8 meets the Indian Challenger engine.
The Revolution Max has been stated as 500 to 1250cc. It will power the new Sportster line, and we will certainly see that line expand, possibly as early as January.
But the Rev Max is not the engine for a 900 lb bagger.
I expect a new generation of 45-degree Big Twin to power the next revamp of the touring bikes, with huge pistons, long strokes, low RPMs and at least some degree of water cooling. Something more like the Indian Challenger engine, although I would be shocked if it wasn't 45 degrees.
The Revolution Max is a high-RPM, high-horsepower engine. 150 hp at 9,000 RPM and peak torque of 94 ft/lbs at 6,750 RPM. That's not a touring bike engine, and that's not heritage and tradition. Compare that to the Indian. The Challenger is instead a low-RPM, high-torque engine. 122 hp at 5,500 RPM, 128 ft/lbs at 3,500 RPM. That performs like a Stage 4 M8. That's a touring bike engine.
The Rev Max is a highly over square engine, the bore is 1.46x as big as the stroke. The M8 is an undersquare design.
Summing it up: the Revolution Max is a great engine for high revving sporty bikes like Sportsters and Adventure bikes and sport-tourers. But for the touring bikes, yes, someday they will evolve toward liquid cooling, but I strongly doubt they will move to the Rev Max. Instead I expect something closer to the Twin-Cooled M8 meets the Indian Challenger engine.
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#13
11-21-2022, 02:09 AM
Cruiser
#14
11-22-2022, 08:45 PM
Seasoned HDF Member
That's not the way it's going to go though. Liquid cooled is almost certainly coming, but we've already had Steve Cole confirm that Harley is far from done with 45-degree big twins.
The Revolution Max has been stated as 500 to 1250cc. It will power the new Sportster line, and we will certainly see that line expand, possibly as early as January.
But the Rev Max is not the engine for a 900 lb bagger.
I expect a new generation of 45-degree Big Twin to power the next revamp of the touring bikes, with huge pistons, long strokes, low RPMs and at least some degree of water cooling. Something more like the Indian Challenger engine, although I would be shocked if it wasn't 45 degrees.
The Revolution Max is a high-RPM, high-horsepower engine. 150 hp at 9,000 RPM and peak torque of 94 ft/lbs at 6,750 RPM. That's not a touring bike engine, and that's not heritage and tradition. Compare that to the Indian. The Challenger is instead a low-RPM, high-torque engine. 122 hp at 5,500 RPM, 128 ft/lbs at 3,500 RPM. That performs like a Stage 4 M8. That's a touring bike engine.
The Rev Max is a highly over square engine, the bore is 1.46x as big as the stroke. The M8 is an undersquare design.
Summing it up: the Revolution Max is a great engine for high revving sporty bikes like Sportsters and Adventure bikes and sport-tourers. But for the touring bikes, yes, someday they will evolve toward liquid cooling, but I strongly doubt they will move to the Rev Max. Instead I expect something closer to the Twin-Cooled M8 meets the Indian Challenger engine.
The Revolution Max has been stated as 500 to 1250cc. It will power the new Sportster line, and we will certainly see that line expand, possibly as early as January.
But the Rev Max is not the engine for a 900 lb bagger.
I expect a new generation of 45-degree Big Twin to power the next revamp of the touring bikes, with huge pistons, long strokes, low RPMs and at least some degree of water cooling. Something more like the Indian Challenger engine, although I would be shocked if it wasn't 45 degrees.
The Revolution Max is a high-RPM, high-horsepower engine. 150 hp at 9,000 RPM and peak torque of 94 ft/lbs at 6,750 RPM. That's not a touring bike engine, and that's not heritage and tradition. Compare that to the Indian. The Challenger is instead a low-RPM, high-torque engine. 122 hp at 5,500 RPM, 128 ft/lbs at 3,500 RPM. That performs like a Stage 4 M8. That's a touring bike engine.
The Rev Max is a highly over square engine, the bore is 1.46x as big as the stroke. The M8 is an undersquare design.
Summing it up: the Revolution Max is a great engine for high revving sporty bikes like Sportsters and Adventure bikes and sport-tourers. But for the touring bikes, yes, someday they will evolve toward liquid cooling, but I strongly doubt they will move to the Rev Max. Instead I expect something closer to the Twin-Cooled M8 meets the Indian Challenger engine.
So you are saying that because it's not a stroker it won't make any TQ? Displacement makes TQ.. The advantage of shorter stoke is that you can rev it higher.. HD could take that motor and grow it equally both bore and stroke.. Probably easier to stroke it since the old guys don't like to rev the motors.
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#17
02-28-2023, 05:42 AM
I’ve gone through a 2020 Road Glide Special, a 2021 Pan America Special, to a 2022 Nightster. The Milwaukee 8 is perfect, in a Touring bike. But for me, based on my personal experience of 52 years on various bikes & engines, the Revolution engine is absolutely a keeper. I hope Harley never drops their big air-cooled twins, but the Revolution engine gives them a tool to be competitive in the marketplace.
#18
06-08-2024, 06:14 PM
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'22 975t nightster owner.
As with all 1st gen release of basically anything it has some quirks to work out & also if they want to make it the new Sportster class motor they need come out with more accessories & mod support. The Sportsters were wanted for the multitude of endless builds a person can do to them. These need to start building on that before they lose that fanbase as well. But as far as motor goes. This rev max is a solid base to build on. They are snappy if you want or need or they can dull back throttle response. They have huge potential tbh. As someone that loves both Harleys (my old man had panheads, knuckles, ect.) & rockets (owned a few from 600 up to a liter bike.) this motor is close to combining the 2 perfectly.
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