I think now that the Pan Am is revealed and all the nay-sayers are eating crow with a foot in their mouth...now is the perfect time to release the Bronx (especially in a 1250 variant). Maybe that was Harley's plan all along? They knew the Pan Am would wow the skeptics and clear the negativity path for future models.

 

I want to know where Harley has been hiding these talented engineers all this time. The tech and the designs of the LIvewire and the Pan America are both best in their class. Why has Harley been holding these engineers back?

 

I have been wondering the same thing Fish?

 

Because they're chained to the legacy/heritage design(s) of 50 years ago. When they tried something different (the V-Rod), the faithful and the dealers crapped all over them.

This was a clean-sheet design with a very clear target that allowed the engineers to go wild.

 

It’s nice to see the Harley Davidson designers are stepping away from the “baby boomers think syndrome” That has plagued their company for much too long…I don’t like the looks of this motorcycle, so it’s not for me… But the Bronx did intrigue me As a city zip around ride.

If they built the Bronx with a more upright seating position, and that engine… And sold it as an entry-level motorcycle in the Harley Davidson Lineup… I think they will be on the right path

 

Needs a legit mid-controls option to compete in the power cruiser world with the Diavel, Rocket 3 and VMax and it needs to be able to hang with those power-wise off the dealer floor too, none of this extra $5k for a stage 4 bike to get power that competes with the other bikes in class. This bike won't just be competing with Indian and the rest of the H-D line.

 

The Pan Am (assuming it lives up to its hype) exactly hits where I thought it would, based on the LiveWire. The LiveWire is an outstanding bike (with a very high price tag) and its engineering had me very optimistic for the Pan America.

But why have they been held back? Probably fear of retaliation from "the faithful". Look at Project Nova from over 30 years ago, they made a liquid-cooled V4 prototype, but Willie G handicapped it because he insisted that it look like a V-twin and that the radiators be hidden. It seems to me that much of the restraint has been because of a fear of moving to technologies like liquid cooling. I had a liquid-cooled 50cc Honda NS50 back in 1990, but look how painful the transition to liquid cooling has been for Harley, and how they were only able to dabble with it on the M8, and the market rejected their two prior liquid cooled attempts. Heck, look how they still get crap for having dared to go to Fuel Injection over carburetors!

I tend to think that the world's biggest (purely) motorcycle company's engineers have to have been the most frustrated people on the planet.

IMO,it's a little sad that CEO Jochen Zeitz gets to parade around and take the accolades, when Levatitch is clearly the guy who unleashed the engineers. Levatitch was CEO during both the Pan America and LiveWire development periods. He was obviously the guy who gave them the "clean slate" approach. These bikes and initiatives are his babies, and he has to watch from the sidelines.

But, again, as exciting as it is to see Harley competing head to head with the best in the world, it's still up to the market to actually buy them to validate whether these were the right choices or not.

 

The 1250 Custom is still coming later this year. Not exactly the Bronx, but it's another arrow in their quiver, and it has the same engine as the Pan America. Speculation is that it will be the new Sportster since Sportsters aren't sold in Europe anymore and the new engine is Europe-emissions-compliant.

 

Well, it doesn't need to compete with the VMax, since Yamaha discontinued that.

And it's kind of hard to imagine a 1250cc engine competing in power against the Rocket 3 with its 2,453cc engine. The Harley 1250 will come reasonably close in power, but only a little over half the torque. Then again, it should clock in at about half the price of the Rocket 3, so I don't know that people are going to be cross-shopping those two bikes.

As for the Diavel, the stated specs are very similar (1260 vs 1250cc, 159 vs 150 hp, etc) it looks like the Custom should be right on par with the Ducati.

 

I know the MoCo CEO gets a lot of negativity on these pages, but from what I have seen is a "real" motorcyclist and is leading with that understanding. While these programs started prior to him taking the helm, I am beginning to gain confidence that he actually has a plan for turning this around. It starts with acknowledging the heritage but not being bound to it (Indian has played that well). The MoCo has more heritage to draw upon, just look how they introduced the future by talking about where they have come from. It is a great story. As the engineers become more inspired, thereby drawing in new fresh talent, I can foresee exciting times ahead. And the beauty is that they don't have to take it as a one or the other - the legacy bikes will still have an important place.