Time for a fluid change
#11
I changed my fluids this afternoon . Mobil 1 V twin in the crank case , 20w50 . Now here is where I deviated from the norm . I went with Super tech full synthetic gear oil 75w140 in the tranny , and Super tech type f ATF in primary . I have been using Super tech synthetic 5w30 in my car and I have 153k miles in 5 years on it , and it runs like the day I bought it . So , when I was in Wally world this morning , I saw it and I figured "What the hell" . I put 70 miles on it after the change . Shifts buttery smooth . Clutch seems to engage very sold , and everything sounds real quiet . I thought I noticed some excess heat coming from my primary , but it was about 93 degrees , in stop and go traffic , so , I digress .
Sounds like you're in good shape. Regarding Supertech fluids...I've been using Supertech oils in my Toyota Tacoma and Nissan Maxima for years and have never had any problems. I'm not sure who makes the oil for WalMart, but surely it's a major company and is would be fine. With all the standards on with oil...I doubt seriously that there's very little different in any of it that's the same weight. Synthetic or Dino. I also use Supertech oil filters on my vehicles. I've read that Champion makes them and that they are a lot better than Fram which are double in price.
#12
Well I'll disagree with that, ESPECIALLY when you compare dino to syn oils - there IS no comparison, really. Shear tests, flashpoints, and the other associated factors have a LOT to do with longevity in a motor. It's one reason you won't see me ever pouring motor oil in my gearbox; there is better stuff made for it.
I've been using Amsoil, and noticed a good difference in the tranny with it, but next oil change I'll be using Mobil1 15/50 car oil in the engine. This after talking with the Mobil tech and asking about the rumors of taking out the phosphorus and zinc that protect the motor - it doesn't apply to the heavy oils, only the energy savers.
The M1V isn't necessary since our big twin clutches have their own oil bath, and the formula isn't required. He actually recommended the 15/50.
Anything will work in the primary that doesn't have friction modifiers that can make a clutch slip - but I'm not convinced that ATF has enough lubricity to protect the chain and sprockets from premature wear. Yet. There must be SOME reason they wanted a 40 wt in there, and I think even dino oil would be fine for this, although syn is always going to do better with wear factors.
I've been using Amsoil, and noticed a good difference in the tranny with it, but next oil change I'll be using Mobil1 15/50 car oil in the engine. This after talking with the Mobil tech and asking about the rumors of taking out the phosphorus and zinc that protect the motor - it doesn't apply to the heavy oils, only the energy savers.
The M1V isn't necessary since our big twin clutches have their own oil bath, and the formula isn't required. He actually recommended the 15/50.
Anything will work in the primary that doesn't have friction modifiers that can make a clutch slip - but I'm not convinced that ATF has enough lubricity to protect the chain and sprockets from premature wear. Yet. There must be SOME reason they wanted a 40 wt in there, and I think even dino oil would be fine for this, although syn is always going to do better with wear factors.
Last edited by Quadancer; 08-11-2010 at 08:40 PM.
#13
Well I'll disagree with that, ESPECIALLY when you compare dino to syn oils - there IS no comparison, really. Shear tests, flashpoints, and the other associated factors have a LOT to do with longevity in a motor. It's one reason you won't see me ever pouring motor oil in my gearbox; there is better stuff made for it.
I've been using Amsoil, and noticed a good difference in the tranny with it, but next oil change I'll be using Mobil1 15/50 car oil in the engine. This after talking with the Mobil tech and asking about the rumors of taking out the phosphorus and zinc that protect the motor - it doesn't apply to the heavy oils, only the energy savers.
The M1V isn't necessary since our big twin clutches have their own oil bath, and the formula isn't required. He actually recommended the 15/50.
Anything will work in the primary that doesn't have friction modifiers that can make a clutch slip - but I'm not convinced that ATF has enough lubricity to protect the chain and sprockets from premature wear. Yet. There must be SOME reason they wanted a 40 wt in there, and I think even dino oil would be fine for this, although syn is always going to do better with wear factors.
I've been using Amsoil, and noticed a good difference in the tranny with it, but next oil change I'll be using Mobil1 15/50 car oil in the engine. This after talking with the Mobil tech and asking about the rumors of taking out the phosphorus and zinc that protect the motor - it doesn't apply to the heavy oils, only the energy savers.
The M1V isn't necessary since our big twin clutches have their own oil bath, and the formula isn't required. He actually recommended the 15/50.
Anything will work in the primary that doesn't have friction modifiers that can make a clutch slip - but I'm not convinced that ATF has enough lubricity to protect the chain and sprockets from premature wear. Yet. There must be SOME reason they wanted a 40 wt in there, and I think even dino oil would be fine for this, although syn is always going to do better with wear factors.
#15
Well I'll disagree with that, ESPECIALLY when you compare dino to syn oils - there IS no comparison, really. Shear tests, flashpoints, and the other associated factors have a LOT to do with longevity in a motor. It's one reason you won't see me ever pouring motor oil in my gearbox; there is better stuff made for it.
#16
I get your sarcasm, but actually not true. Viscosity in the gears tends to go down more than syn. Agreeably, we don't have "gears" in the big twin motor like in the tranny, so shear breakdown is much less.
I just unsuccessfully tried to find the report on my computer; still looking. Then you have the list of HD oils that are now obsolete as they improved things -
Transmission Oil
HD semi synthetic (*obsolete) up to 1984
Primary Oil
H-D Primary oil (*obsolete)
H-D Special light (*obsolete) 1971 - 1983
H-D Sport-trans oil (*obsolete) 1984 to recent
Even the Moco seems to eventually rely on the pulse of the masses to some extent. I'm also still seeing one website where the guy is pushing the "bearing skate" thing - which I'll concede may be possible in the older Harleys with the much looser tolerances, but I really don't know for sure. Guys are getting crazy miles on engines broken in on dino then run on syn. so that's my route.
I just unsuccessfully tried to find the report on my computer; still looking. Then you have the list of HD oils that are now obsolete as they improved things -
Transmission Oil
HD semi synthetic (*obsolete) up to 1984
Primary Oil
H-D Primary oil (*obsolete)
H-D Special light (*obsolete) 1971 - 1983
H-D Sport-trans oil (*obsolete) 1984 to recent
Even the Moco seems to eventually rely on the pulse of the masses to some extent. I'm also still seeing one website where the guy is pushing the "bearing skate" thing - which I'll concede may be possible in the older Harleys with the much looser tolerances, but I really don't know for sure. Guys are getting crazy miles on engines broken in on dino then run on syn. so that's my route.
#19
Don't castrate me but I have a leak I can't find so I went down to the local honda sealer and picked up some Bel ray 75W that is red. Hoping I would be able to spot the leak so far nothing. I hear what your saying about the viscoscity. But I swear the the dino oil I took out (20/50?) was thicker than the 75 W Bel Ray. It's what the dirt bikes run in there engine cases.
120 miles thus far...But thinking I have made a major screw up I have 32 oZ of the old leaking stuff to go back in.
120 miles thus far...But thinking I have made a major screw up I have 32 oZ of the old leaking stuff to go back in.
#20
Yeah man, I doubt that the thick oil will come out so noticeably, but the tried and true oldschool trick was to get the area really clean and just run it until it warms up, stop and check with a light, run more if needed, and so forth until you get seepage.
That said, I wonder if you could just put a little food coloring in - but that might be asking for big trouble if you aren't planning on changing the oil out.
Equally, the Amsoil 75/90 I put in looked thinnish to me too. I read somewhere that the gear oils aren't measured the way they were before, and rely more on additives. So the numbers won't equate your 90wt to a bottle full of cold honey. Whatever all that means. All I know is I can get neutral now a little easier.
Which side is the leak on? You probably only have either the output shaft seal or a gasket leaking; gaskets shouldn't be hard to fix.
Oh, and you'll want to get one of those little mirrors on a stick.
That said, I wonder if you could just put a little food coloring in - but that might be asking for big trouble if you aren't planning on changing the oil out.
Equally, the Amsoil 75/90 I put in looked thinnish to me too. I read somewhere that the gear oils aren't measured the way they were before, and rely more on additives. So the numbers won't equate your 90wt to a bottle full of cold honey. Whatever all that means. All I know is I can get neutral now a little easier.
Which side is the leak on? You probably only have either the output shaft seal or a gasket leaking; gaskets shouldn't be hard to fix.
Oh, and you'll want to get one of those little mirrors on a stick.
Last edited by Quadancer; 08-13-2010 at 03:58 PM.
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09-11-2012 11:57 AM