You know, reading abt all these problems could well make a guy just steer clear of the M8

My problem is, I have a 2014 103 Tri Glide everything's good except it has NO roll on power
The 103s just aren't enough motor for the TG w/o some serious builds and I dont want to go that route

I'm going in tomorrow to try and trade for a '17 TG with the M8 107 and only 1200 miles
I've rode these b4, and while not demons at least have a decent roll on with enough torque to
be able to enjoy riding and not listening to the air cleaner make a bunch of noise and go no where
on the 103

Build date was 06/17 so it's at least not one of the EARLY ones, I'll take a ride and have a listen
I'm sure some old fart had it and prolly babied it never rode it then traded for a new 19 114 M8 TG

If we can get together i'll take a chance hopefully it will work out
I DO know that M8 107 is a much better motor for a Tri Glide than a 103

I own a 2015 EG Police which I bot new not one bit of trouble and plenty power
(but that's a stripped EG vs a 1240 lb locomotive trike)
He damn well better work with me after reading all this I don't need much of an excuse to walk

 

I just got a text from the tech working on my bike at the dealership. He said that one of the piston oil cooling jets came loose and fell out -- that's what took out the teeth on the balancer. So now we have a cause for the failure.

 

That sucks. Glad you are covered.

 

It sucks seeing these type of failures, but I'm always surprised how many folks act like the sky is falling. I know HD wasn't the most forthcoming in admiting to issues like sumping, fluid transfer, etc. When you look at the number of M8s in the wild is the failure rate really abnormal is it a normal failure rate?

If you read these forums it's full of people who swear off the M8 platform based on reading these forums. However, usually you'll only see people who've had problem posting here and not all the people out riding and enjoying the M8 platforms with no issues.

I don't always understand it.

Regardless, I'm glad the MOCO is covering your work and hopefully they'll get you whole and back on the street soon.

 

Since sumping is a potentially catastrophic failure mode caused by a design defect, even 1 is too many...been many more than that... definitely an abnormally high failure rate for both sumping and fluid transfer...

 

I am one of those people who won't buy an M8 because of the issues with them. I can only speak for myself, but for me the reason is two fold...

1) The odds v the stakes.... the odds are that an M8 won't sump, but the stakes are very high if it does...

2) The way the MoCo is handling the two M8 problems. And I mean handling the two problems themselves, not their customers..

The trans oil to primary transfer is totally unacceptable. It is NOT designed to work that way. With the M8, they are trying cheap band-aides and also actually changed the spec to an acceptable amount of transfer to limit their costs and liability on the matter... Their current fix is not a true fix. It just reduces the number of transfer problems, coupled with the new found minimum transfer spec..... that's total BS!

The sumping is a case of ignoring the root cause and the MoCo trying to find a cost effective band-aid to limit costs and liability, just like with the trans oil transfer issue.

In both cases, it is 3 years into the M8 production and they still haven't come up with a 100% reliable fix for either problem... they are NOT trying to fix the problem. I suspect they know what it will take and it's too expensive for bottom line. They are just trying to limit liability and cut costs... there are going to be a bunch of PO'd customers when either issue surfaces AFTER the bike is off warranty... Wait for people to start unloading problem M8s (there are many threads of people trading in M8s instead of waiting for a fix) in the used market and used bike buyers come on all the forums looking for the "fix" for their oil transfer or sumping issues that doesn't exist....

It's the MoCo's failure to fix the issues properly from the get-go that have me keeping my money in my pocket... Especially when they seem more interested in minimizing exposure rather than a proper fix...

I have 3 Twin Cams and they are all very good bikes, I'd really LIKE an M8, but don't NEED an M8... that's the way it will stay until if/when the MoCo fixes those issues to MY satisfaction....

 

It's a fair concern and your call to make on not buying the M8. That's the beauty of free enterprise, we're all free to vote with our wallets.

All I'm saying is the Twin Cams had similar problems. Cam Tensioners, overheating issues, etc.

Outside of the forums, I don't see many people complaining of sumping or fluid transfer. I think there is a bit of confirmation bias happening on this forum which is compounded by the fact that you principal hear from people who have problems and not people who aren't having problems. I'm approaching 30k miles on my M8 with no issues. To be fair, I did spend an additional $500 to buy the S&S cam plate and oil pump as a precautionary measure. They were both installed when I did my stage 2 upgrade last week.

I haven't had any noticeable fluid transfer, but I've kept my transmission and primary fluids the same (formula+) just in case.

Either way, this is a rambling post to say I disagree with your assessment, but I'm glad we're all free to make our own choices. In my case I decided that the low probability of sumping (especially after addressing the oil pump/cam plate) even when coupled with the high consequence of sumping weren't enough to dissuade me from the M8.

 

I'm not sure I agree with the assessment that it's a design problem causing sumping. If it was a design problem it should show in every bike operated outside the design parameters. Since a fairly small number of bikes are sumping, I tend to believe it's a problem with production process or is a design issue, but only when the bikes are operated in a way at the edge of the operating envelope.

That doesn't excuss HD for having the problem, but it changes the way you need to look at the problem.

 

How many M8's have more than 10,000 miles on them. Probably not many!

I had a '17 Limited. 23,000 miles never a issue with the motor or trans...

I buy a '19 Limited with the 114". It sumped at 7,400 miles. They did the update per SB M1450. Got the bike back and it sumped again within 30 miles. I was without a bike for 5 weeks of prime riding weather. First time I've missed Bike Week in 36 years because of a broken scoot!

Dealer traded me out of my first '19 for $$$$. Now have my second '19 Limited. Well with this POS I'm losing transmission lube. At 600 miles it was 7-8oz low. I topped the tranny off the day the bike was delivered. Now I get to muck around with the transfer issue.

I feel like a complete idiot putting money into a second 2019. Should have waited for the first one to get patched up and traded it to my local Honda shop for a Goldwing. The MOCO was useless. 5 weeks jerking my chain before a move was made. Called Harley Customer DisService 4 times. Haven't heard back from them yet.

I ride 18-30,000 a year. Too many miles to screw around with Harley and it's defects. If you're not affected by problems, great! If you are it's **** city!

Two friends had '17 Limiteds. They wanted '19s but were waiting to see what happened with mine and how it was handled. They both now own Goldwing! Just because of this screw up and the way it was so poorly handled Harley and the dealership lost 3 guys that buy a new bike every year or two!

Good Luck to M8 buyers. It's a crap shoot.... How lucky do you feel?

 

Well, not mine but that wasn't my fault - first stock engine sumped at 5600 miles, replacement sumped 600 miles after that. That replacement lasted 400 miles, then Harley replaced the bike. Now I've got about 7400 on the new bike.

But to the other poster's point, yes, I started threads when all this happened, but not to claim that its some big universal problem and to warn others not to buy one, I just was interested in the advice of others and to understand who else had had these issues.

I love the bike, and in fact depending on what comes out in 2020, I may very well trade for a new one.