Harley earnings up
#21
10-25-2018, 04:46 AM
Outstanding HDF Member
IMHO one of the main reasons is due to people not being able to afford the cost of the bikes. Most new riders are going to metric bike as those are much less money for much more motorcycle. HD has nothing to offer them at this point in time. If you want to talk about the "Street" model in that market HD is over priced by more than a few thousand for a bike that under performs by miles to what the metric bikes offer. That's where the new riders are going, then if you look at Sportsters you've got the same issue and the bike has had no updated for over 10 years other than paint and looks, it just well out of date for the market. Most of the Touring market is completely out of reach for the new riders so it goes to us old farts that can afford it, and plenty are getting tired of getting the run around with problems that HD doesn't care to address.
So it's no wonder the market is shrinking and saying we still have the biggest part of a shrinking market to try and say its all OK is just dumb, IMHO. The accountants spin to keep the stock prices from going down the tubes like it did back in 2008. Time will tell but so far, it's not looking so good.
So it's no wonder the market is shrinking and saying we still have the biggest part of a shrinking market to try and say its all OK is just dumb, IMHO. The accountants spin to keep the stock prices from going down the tubes like it did back in 2008. Time will tell but so far, it's not looking so good.
#22
10-25-2018, 05:53 AM
Stellar HDF Member
BMW’s are just as expensive. One advantage Harley has is resale value, they tend to hold value better than other brands. If Harley dropped prices by 5k it would impact that, then you would have a bunch of pissed of owners. All they really need to do is build some modern bikes at competitive prices, I hope that’s the plan with the street fighter and such. Most manufacturers have multiple lines of bikes (cruisers, sport, adv), Harley really only has one.
#23
10-25-2018, 06:58 AM
Road Captain
BMW’s are just as expensive. One advantage Harley has is resale value, they tend to hold value better than other brands. If Harley dropped prices by 5k it would impact that, then you would have a bunch of pissed of owners. All they really need to do is build some modern bikes at competitive prices, I hope that’s the plan with the street fighter and such. Most manufacturers have multiple lines of bikes (cruisers, sport, adv), Harley really only has one.
#24
10-25-2018, 08:10 AM
As announced a few days ago the MOCO sales figures have taken another huge hit for the last quarter. Comparing them to the same quarter of last year it indicates a drop off of 13.7%. Now that is a hit in any accountants book. But, the spin meisters say that "profits are up though". Well, what has occurred here is that the MOCO chieftans have known that sales are plunging so they pull out all the stops to cut costs. This is exactly what has occurred. Then, to make matters worse yet they get hit with what they are calling a 35 million dollar expense to recall the 2017 and 2018 touring bikes for clutch problems.
In short what has occurred here is that the MOCO has followed the cardinal rule in management which is to get YOUR COSTS INLINE WITH SALES. Slashing costs if fairly easy to do. Increasing sales is not, especially if your sales have been falling since the model year 2006.
In short what has occurred here is that the MOCO has followed the cardinal rule in management which is to get YOUR COSTS INLINE WITH SALES. Slashing costs if fairly easy to do. Increasing sales is not, especially if your sales have been falling since the model year 2006.
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artsbest (10-25-2018)
#25
10-25-2018, 08:16 AM
Amazing. Same ‘ol, same ‘ol. Same lousy company performance. Same commentary. Quarter after quarter after quarter. No one should be surprised given HD dragging their heels for 2.5 yrs before they finally addressed the clutch issues. And sumping is still an ongoing failure risk for thousands of bikes on the road. Oh well I can just chk back in another 3 months to read the same declining qrtly sales report and the same commentary.
Last edited by Heatwave; 10-25-2018 at 08:17 AM.
#26
10-25-2018, 01:25 PM
Seasoned HDF Member
IF unit sales are down, there is nothing positive about that. Accountants can only pull tricks out of their hats for so long when sales are going down year over year. HD has made it's own problems for years. Their pricing has gotten ridiculous in the past few years in my opinion. That can't be good for unit sales. There ARE other manufacturers out there. They DO have competition. The Faithful do have limits to what they will endure.
#27
10-25-2018, 01:46 PM
Road Warrior
It's a good thing HD isn't run by popular opinion because most of us have no idea on how a business makes money.
- Used bikes and cars lose value when new purchase interest rates are low - they are.
- Closing the plant in KC is not popular and moving attention to other markets around the world is a reality they have to confront.
- Made in America is great but look what happened to GM. HD has to make tough choices on this issue.
- Moving into other market categories is really hard. We'll have to give them time and understand a lot of things will fail. Hopefully something catches on.
- Used bikes and cars lose value when new purchase interest rates are low - they are.
- Closing the plant in KC is not popular and moving attention to other markets around the world is a reality they have to confront.
- Made in America is great but look what happened to GM. HD has to make tough choices on this issue.
- Moving into other market categories is really hard. We'll have to give them time and understand a lot of things will fail. Hopefully something catches on.
#28
10-25-2018, 01:48 PM
Tourer
That should read U.S. Union labor is expensive. Honda did it for years building great bikes out of Ohio staying well under Harely's prices.
#29
10-25-2018, 05:45 PM
Road Master
All of this if fun and great to talk about but at the end of the day, Harley is shrinking because the market is shrinking. You can only be as big as the market is. I think H-D would serve themselves better but including some of the features other manufacturers do, but I’m not convinced having “riding modes” or a “power windshield” would actually translate into more market share. The brand is still incredibly strong, the 115th showed that, and used bike sales are strong. HD still owns over half the US market to themselves. The market also shrank 10% year over year. If the market were growing but H-D was having these kinds of quarters I’d be worried, the company’s still very profitable, the brands still very strong. HD isn’t going anywhere, but motorcycles definetly don’t seem to be something the up and coming generation is interested in. The key to surviving is having the company be the right size for the market, which is what they are doing.
As as long as they keep building road glides in the USA I for one am not goin anywhere.
As as long as they keep building road glides in the USA I for one am not goin anywhere.
