Agreed! in 1992 I had 10 grand in hand and there werent any Harleys to be had. People were buying them and reselling them for thousands over what they paid. Yes, the winds of change are blowing. For some reason, the young crowd do not buy them. Not just Harley, any motorcycle. Its really a shame.

 

Coming from someone that has purchased and rode 12 new Harleys over a 28 year period, Harleys are not overpriced, some models are simply not as competitive as they should be. I'm really addressing the touring line.

More and more, serious touring riders, those that actually pack in the miles want a powerful motor right off the showroom floor, want a modern suspension system that rides smooth, provides comfort, great handling, brakes and all the modern features that add to enjoyment. Harley has the best paint and chrome but those are not the priority for serious touring riders.

while I still admire Harley, I switched to the new BMW K1600B or Bagger. 6cyl putting out 160hp and 129lb of torque. An amazing suspension system and all the modern features for the price of a Road Glide. Had Harley upped it's game on the touring line I would own one. For starters the 114 inch motor should be standard. The touring line should have a frame and suspension more like the softail line and features like reverse, heated seat and grips should be standard. Power locking should also be available at a low cost. It's not so much a issue with 25K, it's what you get compared to the competition.

 

 

You know you wanna sell that turd and come back to the dark side? Or you wouldn't be posting on here.

 

All the options you named except for reverse are there but it will you cost 42k big ones or more. IMHO that is what people are talking about when the say "Harley is overpriced" compared to the competition harleys look and feel better and have soul but you do get more options standard with other bikes.

 

??? Doesn't the new Yamaha come with heated seat, heated grips, reverse, electricly adjusted wind screen and better lighting , navigation, stereo, and much more, plus a huge discount off MSRP?

 

This is what happens when you market and sell an image/brand rather than produce and sell a competitive product. Millennial's, well they aren't buying into the image/brand nonsense. The HD product, well it can't compete on it's own technical merit in the market place. HD relies on the "feels beter/soul' marketing nonsense that you mentioned. That (160HP/129TQ) K1600 that scott mentioned costs $20K for the base model. It's technically superior in every way to anything HD sells (other than image). Is the image really worth an additional $20K if you actually just want to put down the miles and ride the wheels off of of the thing?

 

And yet... Harley sells more 600cc+ bikes than Kawasaki, Yamaha, Honda, Suzuki, Ducati, Indian, BMW, Husqvarna, Aprilia, Benelli, Moto Guzzi, MV Augusta, and all other makers, COMBINED.

Can't compete? Really?

I'm very familiar with that K1600, the K1600B. I love that damn thing, and want to buy one. To be fair, the 160hp/129tq is flywheel; once it gets to the wheels it's more like 135/110. Still more than any stock Harley, but not a massive gulf. And there's no doubt, the BMW is more technically sophisticated than any Harley. Electronic suspension adjustment, power adjustable windscreen, and on and on. I want one. I am waiting on reviews and a comparison shootout between the new Gold Wing and the K1600B Grand America at some point. And the base model of the K1600B costs only, theoretically, if you could buy it, about $1000 more than the stripped-down Fat Bob that I did buy. I will not argue that the Harley is up there with the BMW in technology, nor in features.

But... for some reason, maybe I'm too stupid, I don't know, I bought another Harley. Because it did something for me that the BMW didn't. And -- that something, seems to be happening for a lot of folks. BMW can't even hardly sell K1600's to BMW customers, fer cryin' out loud; some absurd proportion of BMW sales is RT1200's and GS1200's. The big-dog GS1200A, by itself, is BMW's best-selling model and 15% of all their bikes sold are GS1200A's. I had heard, but cannot verify, that only something like 73 K1600GT's were even being brought into the USA this year. And yet -- the K1600GT will ride the wheels off any Harley.

I mean -- you're not wrong. The BMW is vastly technically superior than any competing Harley at its same price point.

And yet...

BMW sold 13,500 motorcycles in the USA last year. All year. Harley sold 148,000 bikes in the USA last year.

So why aren't people buying the technical marvels at their lower price points? Why will Harley sell more Ultras this weekend, than BMW will probably sell K1600GTL's all year? Must be some reason... let's think... maybe... maybe... people actually DO want that freedom/soul/brand/marketing/lifestyle/whatever that Harley sells, along with their bikes?

 

Maybe so. We'll see. Time will tell.

 

Amen. Having owned a few Japanese two wheeled technical marvels myself it’s hard to explain why I love Harleys so much more than them. It isn’t just marketing, although I must admit HD has done a masterful job of that. When I wheeled into the Harley dealership on my Goldwing for my first ever Harley test ride I really had no intention of trading. But once I got on that Harley and let out the clutch the first time I just had to have it. Now I’m on my second Harley and love it more every day. Hard to explain really.