I think that facts are just getting in the way of the 'feelings' for some people. Harley has been dying for 115 years...it just depends who you talk to. They did almost go under at least a couple of times but they keep coming back like some sort of living dead zombi. It's too bad that all that stagnation talk must be centered on there being chrome on the bike or something...they have CAN networks, ABS, new single shock frames, vented windshields, FI, ride by wire....and the list goes on and on. I suppose they do not have a 300 lb turbocharged 250 HP bike in the lineup so some don't like it....why are they here?

Oh well, just rambling. Some, like you, toss water on the fire but there are a lot that keep throwing fuel for some reason.

 

Everything you say is correct but for the life of me I don't know why the VTX line didn't do better than it did. My other bike is a 2007 VTX 1800 that I bought brand new in 2009. It sat at the Honda warehouse (not dealership) in a crate for two years before I picked it up for almost half of retail. They were really dumping them. Yesterday I eclipsed 80,000 miles and other than replacing the water pump at 60,000 miles, which is basically normal maintenance, I have not had one problem with that bike. For some reason they just didn't catch on.

 

I understand what you're saying, but I don't think you're properly presenting the picture. It is my understanding that Harley has 53% of the "big bike" market -- defined as, over 600cc. So that's touring, yes, but it's also cruisers and sportbikes and adventure bikes and nakeds and everything else. If you add up all the BMW GS1200's, Honda CBR1000RR's, Kawasaki Ninja's 600+, etc., etc., etc., and add them all to the Indian and BMW and Big 4 Japanese touring bikes, and all the 600cc sportbikes and 750's and 1000cc supersports and all that, from Italy or England or Japan or wherever... Harley still has a more than 50% market share of that 600cc+ segment.

Sales are falling. Nobody denies that. But sales are falling overall for all motorcycle makers in America and in Japan. Yes Indian is getting a bigger piece of a smaller pie, but Harley still has 53% of that pie.

 

Wow, I love it when Oleboy works his magic.......... Poor Cooky.......... Babblecookie.... LMAO.... He called him Babblecookie.... Man I bet you guys would have fun if ya drank a beer together.... I know Id laugh my *** off.

This is why I love the Forums.......

 

This is a refreshing thread. Im glad others get it too!

Bottom line Harley still has the same amount of the marketplace, Harley sells 50% (+/- a couple percent) of all motorcycles in the USA that are over 605cc's.
This has not changed over the last few years, gosh, I still remember when the metric bikes were going to kill Harley, then Victory was going to kill Harley, Victory is out of business and the metrics *** has been wiped in the 600+ cc market.
Its not Harley, its the market, young people are not into motorcycles.

Oh wait, now its Indian that is hurting Harley, NO again *L*
Indian is nothing more then a bee sting on a bear. (so far)
Its easy for Indian to post big sales gain, when you sell 1 motorcycle in one year, then sell 2 motorcycles the next year, that is a 100% increase in sales!
Add to that, Polaris does NOT disclose Indian sales figures, it also classifies the slingshot as a motorcycle so that is also in the sales numbers.

Nothing at all against Indian, glad to see competition, just again, Harley is holding its own and Indian to their credit seems like a quality bike and in the same price range and higher then Harley.

 

Absolutely!



And just to point out the OBVIOUS: This is the polar opposite of how things used to be in the world of motorcycles about...ohh...30 years ago.

 

He winds up so easily and he's entertaining. Everyone on here knows that these things are overpriced.

 

I have a funny story about that, my buddy just bought his first Harley from an Indian dealer, it was a nice clean little nightster. Anyways, I was walking around checking out the chieftains and stuff and sat on a couple, They’re a decent bike, not my thing but a cool bike no doubt, anyways I notice he has a lot of used Harley’s in his showroom, like most of the bikes in there were used Harley’s, after we’re done with paper work and stuff my buddy mentions to the salesman that I had a brand new road glide, and he starts going on and on about the 30 silent recalls on the M8 and how he’s got friends that are Harley techs and salesman and they’re telling everyone not to buy M8s. I told him I think it’s funny you **** on Harley so much because from the looks of your showroom Harley is keeping you business, you probably sell more used Harley’s than you do new Indians. He said he had to go handle something after I said that and bid us farewell.

 

I’m late to this party so if I’m repaeating something someone else has already said, my apologies. It is to any company’s advantage to price their product as low as they posssibly can without losing money. That includes HD. Once upon a time new Harleys cost a lot more than new Hondas for a few different reasons. First, there was no such thing as a comparable Honda. Japanese bikes were like Japanese cars. Small and underpowered compared to their US made counterparts. They were very reliable but still cheaply made by comparison. Back then, Japanese labor costs were much lower than American labor costs so it naturally cost a lot more to build a motorcycle in the US. These days, the labor cost equation has equalized to a large degree as have the products. Americans who buy top of the line Hondas expect a top quality product and they’re willing to pay for it. Hence, some Goldwing models actually cost more than comparable Harley touring bikes. To say that Harleys cost too much is to single HD out as somehow being more overpriced than other big ticket items. Back in the 80s I thought $16,000 was a ridiculous amount of money for a new Chevrolet. Today, I think I’m getting off light at $40,000. Is General Motors gouging their customers with overpriced vehicles? It would seem so until you compare their prices with Ford and Toyota. Why should Harley Davidson be any different?

 

The price you charge is the max amount someone will pay.. basic sales 101
you cannot make up for losses by getting a bigger truck.
Is it better to sell 100 and make $1 ea ( $100 ), or sell one and make $100 ??
and remember " Profit is not a 4 letter word "