Before I get hammered again I better clearify....The ECM is doing EXACTLYwhat it is programmed to do. I my case its a good thing. Not so good for you. Until youknow exactly what it's doing (as opposed to what it doesn't do) you may have a tough road ahead of you. Best case, trail and error. The guys that wrote the programforthe 07 HD ECM are probably the only ones who know for sure whats going on...unfortuanatlythey'renot posting here.

 

BVBOB, we need to confirm if the O2s/closed loop is actually the culprit and, if so,why, you seem to be having one of those problems that can drive a tuner nuts drive a tuner nuts drive a tuner nuts. If it is an O2 problem, is it both cyls or just one. The best way to do this is by going back to "old school" andto put in a fresh set of plugs, drive it in closed loop as close to the ECU's VE range that you are having trouble with until you are having trouble, then look at your plugs ASAP before you do any other type of driving or idleing. Hopefully the plugs will help point us in some direction herebyindicating if the tune is going lean or rich and if withone or both cylinders. The majority of the time, if it's an O2 reading problem due to cam overlap or exh air contamination, the plug(s) will look too rich.

Here are some possibilities from past experiance with problems such as yours. One or two of the O2s couldbe defective andnot reading correctly because they previously got contaminated because of an overly rich condition somewhere along our tuning process. An exhaust leak, such as where the exh pipe mates to the head is a common problem that will resemble a cam overlap problem but will be a problem throughout the RPM/load range. A cam overlap problemwillusually only show up at or near idle. Could go on but first we need to do the plug routine tohelp point us in some direction, then go on. By the way, if you are getting a CEL, do we know what the errorcode is? Where's that guy who thinks any completetune should only take 1-2 Hrs?

 

BVBOB: If I remember correctly, turning off the Closed Loop in AFR still gave you a CEL..........does this give you an indication that Closed Loop is affecting the ECM regardless of the 14.6 switch being active?

The latest SERT Software still describes previous tuning methods(from SERT Manual):

Tuning with Closed-Loop

Only calibrations that are closed-loop capable can be used for closed-loop operation. When a calibration is opened in Tuning Mode, a box in the upper right region of the screen will indicate if a calibration is intended for open or closed-loop operation.
The AFR table controls the operating conditions in which the ECM will enable closed-loop. The AFR cell must equal 14.6 for the ECM to enable closed-loop operation. This allows the user to control if and when the bike is in closed-loop simply using the AFR table.
For tuning of the VE tables, the recommended method has not changed. The AFR table should be set to 13.2 in all cells; this will put the bike into open-loop operation. The VE tables are then tuned to achieve the 13.2 in all conditions. Upon completion, the AFR table should be returned to its previous settings. This will return the bike to closed-loop operation.
The new table that has been added this year is the Closed-Loop Bias table. This table is used to shift the AFR richer or leaner during closed-loop operation. This table is a function of engine speed and map load. The cell values are the switching voltage that the ECM controls to. A lower voltage will control leaner, and a higher number controls richer. This table is used by the ECM in addition to the AFR table to determine what AFR to control to.

And from the SERT Tuning Mode Help Files:

Tuning with Closed-Loop
Only calibrations that are closed-loop capable can be used for closed-loop operation. When a calibration is opened in Tuning Mode, a box in the upper right region of the screen will indicate if a calibration is intended for open or closed-loop operation.
The AFR table controls the operating conditions in which the ECM will enable closed-loop. The AFR cell must equal 14.6 for the ECM to enable closed-loop operation. This allows the user to control if and when the bike is in closed-loop using the AFR table.

Thanks for any feedback..........

[sm=icon_cheers.gif]

 

You are correct, the maps are not designed to be crossed over to a different ECM.....

Your ECM is designed to run a Closed Loop map.....

If you want to take your Closed loop out of the Picture, just set your DESIRED AFR to 14 vice 14.6.....

Remember, the trigger is the 14.6 Desired AFR for the o2's to go into adaptive fuel.....

When you set the entire Desired AFR to 13 for tuning purposes, they are a non player.....

As far as the DTT, I was under the presumption that you were to run the o2 Sniffer at the end of the Exhaust stream, and plumb a sniffer tube up the exhaust pipe....

You might want to look at this as a viable change to your current style of tuning.....

The ECM isn't able to get correct data, and therefore is probably going into a "Limp Home Mode"...

 

With the ecm being set at 13.2, there should be no feedback from the factory 02's, that is why I use the factory bungs for tuning with the twinscan, being closer to the head they should be more accurate, The problem is, apparently the ecm still looks for the 02 sensors at some intervals, it will come up with front and rear 02 low/open CEL The bike is easy to tune and runs excellent inopen loop, if I could just get rid of the CEL I would be more than happy at this point, the other possibility is that with the map out of the 14.6 number and tuned to the afr numbers in the map, I may just be able to replace the factory 02 sensors so they are there when the ecm checks for them, but there is also the possiblilty that even when the entire map is under the 14.6 target the ecm still looks to integrate the 02 sensor on occasion, there would be no other explantion for it throwing a code otherwise. Thanks for the replies, will be interesting to see how this thing shakes out.

 

Just one more question for you guys, when the ECM throws a CEL code for the missing 02 sensors and goes into limp mode, is limp mode simply the bike running off of the VE and afr map you have created with the SERT or does it have a completely different set of values it runs off of, and Cjuetten, I for one think you are right on the money with your Idea of the ecm using info from closed loop and using it in open areas of the map. At the risk of getting bashed myself, has anyone tried using 02 eliminators with the SERT?

 

holy crap! I am definately subscribing to this thread! Getting my SERT in a couple weeks...