Power Vision Information Thread
#2031
03-26-2012 | 12:51 AM
Road Master
Joined: Feb 2010
Posts: 1,232
Likes: 60
From: Albany, OR
Question 1 - in column MAP20 on PV for my 2011 SG, will there be a big differance in MPG and cooling if my AFR is lowered from 14.4 -14.0 to 13.6 ? I have a canned Map from FM. My current MAP from 30-80KPA is all set to 14.4. Dynojet has a perf improved and they set the AFR to 14.0 across..
Question 2 - i have been doing Basic tuning with the PV. The adaptive Control is set to 1 (on) - to what i understand if i tune below 14.2 AFR, i need to select Adaptive control to 0 (off) after I am happy with my VE tables ( open loop) ? is this correct.. Been since last year i played with the PV... began reading all the threads and now i got confused again.... I dont have the AT option with my PV.
Question 2 - i have been doing Basic tuning with the PV. The adaptive Control is set to 1 (on) - to what i understand if i tune below 14.2 AFR, i need to select Adaptive control to 0 (off) after I am happy with my VE tables ( open loop) ? is this correct.. Been since last year i played with the PV... began reading all the threads and now i got confused again.... I dont have the AT option with my PV.
- You will lose some MPG going all the way to 13.6. Is that really necessary? I don't think the cooling benefits would be worth it, but every motor is different. Try it and find out is the best way. You won't hurt anything.
- In any AFR cell, a value other than 14.6 will trigger the ECM to go into open loop. If you want to run open loop you can just use something other than 14.6, turn off adaptive control, and on some ECMs there is a Closed Loop setting that can also be turned off. AFAIK any combo of these will keep the bike in OL. You don't have to use your O2s all the time, just keep it in OL and remove them. It's best not to have them in there if they aren't being used, they can go bad (from what I've read).
#2032
03-26-2012 | 03:17 AM
Cruiser
Joined: Nov 2011
Posts: 176
Likes: 0
From: Berkeley, CA
2 questions from a new user-
1. On the VE tables...what are the units or values of the #'s that populate the cells. Are they CFM's, or what?
2. From stock to custom tunes, it seems that the rear cylinder flows slightly higher than the front ...is there a simple explanation for this?
TIA, -Chuck
1. On the VE tables...what are the units or values of the #'s that populate the cells. Are they CFM's, or what?
2. From stock to custom tunes, it seems that the rear cylinder flows slightly higher than the front ...is there a simple explanation for this?
TIA, -Chuck
#2033
03-26-2012 | 07:33 AM
Road Warrior
Joined: Jan 2008
Posts: 1,544
Likes: 17
From: Upstate SC
Question 1 - in column MAP20 on PV for my 2011 SG, will there be a big differance in MPG and cooling if my AFR is lowered from 14.4 -14.0 to 13.6 ? I have a canned Map from FM. My current MAP from 30-80KPA is all set to 14.4. Dynojet has a perf improved and they set the AFR to 14.0 across..
Question 2 - i have been doing Basic tuning with the PV. The adaptive Control is set to 1 (on) - to what i understand if i tune below 14.2 AFR, i need to select Adaptive control to 0 (off) after I am happy with my VE tables ( open loop) ? is this correct.. Been since last year i played with the PV... began reading all the threads and now i got confused again.... I dont have the AT option with my PV.
#2034
03-26-2012 | 07:39 AM
2 questions from a new user-
1. On the VE tables...what are the units or values of the #'s that populate the cells. Are they CFM's, or what?
2. From stock to custom tunes, it seems that the rear cylinder flows slightly higher than the front ...is there a simple explanation for this?
TIA, -Chuck
1. On the VE tables...what are the units or values of the #'s that populate the cells. Are they CFM's, or what?
2. From stock to custom tunes, it seems that the rear cylinder flows slightly higher than the front ...is there a simple explanation for this?
TIA, -Chuck
2. The Rear cylinder runs hotter due to less airflow, hence the higher VEs. Mostly in the idle and lower RPM ranges.
#2035
03-26-2012 | 09:43 AM
Road Captain
Joined: Jun 2006
Posts: 580
Likes: 0
From: Colorado
The % is relative to the amount of air the cylinder theoretically can flow. On my 103" for example, each intake and compression stroke should fill approx. 51.5 cubic inches. If that is what was actually happening, then my VE (Volumetric Efficiency) would be 100%. But, do to many factors (cams, compression, intake, exhaust, scavenging, etc...) those numbers will vary quite a bit. If at a given rpm/map you are at 85%, you'll need a bit less fuel to reach your intended AFR. If at 110%, you'll need a bit more.
Last edited by ColoSpgsMark; 03-26-2012 at 11:03 AM.
#2036
03-26-2012 | 10:00 AM
Banned
Joined: Feb 2009
Posts: 275
Likes: 0
From: Maryland
#2037
03-26-2012 | 11:36 AM
Thread Starter
|
Extreme HDF Member
Joined: Sep 2005
Posts: 11,615
Likes: 48
From: Baton Rouge, LA
Was riding today and noticed something funny. I'm done with tuning for the time being and just had regular gauges up. One of those is demanded AFR. I just wanted to watch and be sure it looked right according to my table. All is good except for idle after the bike is warm. Once warm the idle showed the wrong AFR, 14.4 which is what I'm using in cruise range. I'd blip the throttle in case something was stuck, no change. In my 20 KPa column I have 13.0 750-2000 and 12.5 2250+. The 27 KPa column is 14.4 750-3000. Idle wouldn't be at 27KPa? I'd think it would be lower. I was going to look for a KPa item for a gauge but forgot about it and had to get home. I'm curious what my KPa is at idle once warm. The AFR table might need adjustment, I don't want to sit in traffic with 14.4 AFR.
Having the AFR as one of your gauges is handy. You can see the effects of warm up enrichment, decel enleanment, and acceleration enrichment.
It would probably assist those of you having decel popping by seeing what the AFR goes to as you coast to a stop. Mine drops to 12.5 - 12.8 and I don't have any popping. Then once stopped the AFR goes back to 14.4 (which is the above problem).
Last edited by iclick; 03-26-2012 at 11:48 AM.
#2038
03-26-2012 | 11:42 AM
Road Master
Joined: Feb 2010
Posts: 1,232
Likes: 60
From: Albany, OR
[QUOTE=iclick;9576911]
It is the set AFR, but it does change with the effects of those other tables, I was watching it last time I rode. I watched it during warm up, during sudden throttle close, etc. You can see the effects of those other settings with that read out. My table was pretty static so I know the readings I was seeing was due to those other parameters. Let's you know it's all working.
Was riding today and noticed something funny. I'm done with tuning for the time being and just had regular gauges up. One of those is demanded AFR. I just wanted to watch and be sure it looked right according to my table. All is good except for idle after the bike is warm. Once warm the idle showed the wrong AFR, 14.4 which is what I'm using in cruise range. I'd blip the throttle in case something was stuck, no change. In my 20 KPa column I have 13.0 750-2000 and 12.5 2250+. The 27 KPa column is 14.4 750-3000. Idle wouldn't be at 27KPa? I'd think it would be lower. I was going to look for a KPa item for a gauge but forgot about it and had to get home. I'm curious what my KPa is at idle once warm. The AFR table might need adjustment, I don't want to sit in traffic with 14.4 AFR.
Anybody got any ideas?
I may be misinterpreting this, but I think Beasleyiv is monitoring the Set or Desired AFR, which won't change with WUE, DE, or AE. It will just show the Set AFR wherever you are at that point in time.
I think the point at which decel popping stops will vary from bike to bike, as have mine set at 14.0 and have no popping. I think setting it as lean as possible to get rid of the popping, as that way you don't waste fuel.
Anybody got any ideas?
I may be misinterpreting this, but I think Beasleyiv is monitoring the Set or Desired AFR, which won't change with WUE, DE, or AE. It will just show the Set AFR wherever you are at that point in time.
I think the point at which decel popping stops will vary from bike to bike, as have mine set at 14.0 and have no popping. I think setting it as lean as possible to get rid of the popping, as that way you don't waste fuel.
#2039
03-26-2012 | 11:44 AM
Thread Starter
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Extreme HDF Member
Joined: Sep 2005
Posts: 11,615
Likes: 48
From: Baton Rouge, LA
Perfecting DE values
I've been gradually reducing my DE by .01-.02 to get rid of a quick pop at roll-off, usually heard when I shift from 1-2 or 2-3. I have the following values now and would like to know if anyone else is having trouble getting it right and where everyone else has theirs set. Where it is now has mostly gotten rid of it, and I just flashed a tune with -.01 from "Last Tested" that will be checked out today.
------------Stock----Last tested----New untested
205°------- .41 ------- .35 ------------- .34
234°------- .38 ------- .30 ------------- .29
264°+ ---- .34 ------- .26 ------------- .25
------------Stock----Last tested----New untested
205°------- .41 ------- .35 ------------- .34
234°------- .38 ------- .30 ------------- .29
264°+ ---- .34 ------- .26 ------------- .25
#2040
03-26-2012 | 11:47 AM
Thread Starter
|
Extreme HDF Member
Joined: Sep 2005
Posts: 11,615
Likes: 48
From: Baton Rouge, LA
It is the set AFR, but it does change with the effects of those other tables, I was watching it last time I rode. I watched it during warm up, during sudden throttle close, etc. You can see the effects of those other settings with that read out. My table was pretty static so I know the readings I was seeing was due to those other parameters. Let's you know it's all working.