Power Vision Information Thread
#1711
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Flashed it last night and had it out today for about an hour - seemed to run just fine, probably a bit stronger, but not sure if that's my imagination, but nothing outrageously different, I have to say.
One thing is for sure - no more decel popping. Prior to the PV it would do it occasionally, but not very often and certainly nothing I was concerned about but now its pretty much gone from what I can tell.
Also seems to "tick" less when cruising or decelerating from cruising. But again, could be my imagination.
At any rate, seems to run fine.
One thing is for sure - no more decel popping. Prior to the PV it would do it occasionally, but not very often and certainly nothing I was concerned about but now its pretty much gone from what I can tell.
Also seems to "tick" less when cruising or decelerating from cruising. But again, could be my imagination.
At any rate, seems to run fine.
#1712
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I just got a new map from FM and flashed it today and went for a 4 hour ride. It was perfect. I didn't think they could get it this close on the first set of logs but it was perfect. I also thought it had less ticking so maybe it's not just me. Those guys are sure good at what they do.
#1713
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That is all you have to do but I would suggest at least doing some tuning runs to set the VEs for your bike even if you don't change anything else. However, there is a lot of potential in the PV.
#1714
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I would load the map you are going to try, do some logging runs and set the VE table first before making any other changes. If the popping is still there, and it was on my 08, then you can make adjustments. However, setting the VE correctly for your bike is the basis for all other adjustments.
I was able to get 3 good logs in over the week-end to tweak the pre-loaded Fuel Moto map.
In the VE's there was about a 3-5% difference at 750 to 3500 rpm between the original map and the last run. There looked to a lot less betwwen the 2nd and 3rd runs...less than 1% and very few less than than 2%. The timing tables changed some too. As suspected the decel popping was always present from about 1800 on down.
Now, the map FM sent me is in closed loop AFR (14.6 -cruising range) Following what you have suggested on here (Dennis) I ended up richening the AFR to 13.8 @ 20kpa column 750-1500 rpm and 14.0 1500-4000. I also "smoothed" the 30 kpa column from 14.4 to 14.5 from 750 up to 4000. I then reduced the decel enleanment by 50% across the board. This has brought it down to an ever so slight gurgle at slowing down under closed throttle once in a while. if you have any more suggestions I'll keep working on that... All in all, it runs smooth and very strong.
Does it matter that the temps here were in the mid 40's (cold and less humid?) Would the next step be working on the AFR tables for cooling when it gets up into the 70's to 90's in the summer? I imagine that takes it out of closed loop (not that it matters?) I eventually want to end up with a good all around map.
** On a side note here i just took a look at the close loop bias in these maps and everything is set at 700 which to my understanding will put the actual AFR in the 14.3 range while the ECM is is "fooled" into thinking that it's 14.6. Can they be raised more if needed? I also got 40 mpg on the tankful of gas I used during the data log runs! not bad since I rode a little harder than I normally do :-) ...Hmm....I just may be good to go!
Last edited by SGLarry; 02-06-2012 at 10:29 AM.
#1715
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First of all thanks to this thread and everyones contributions it was pretty much easy and enjoyable, rather than painless!
I was able to get 3 good logs in over the week-end to tweak the pre-loaded Fuel Moto map.
In the VE's there was about a 3-5% difference at 750 to 3500 rpm between the original map and the last run. There looked to a lot less betwwen the 2nd and 3rd runs...less than 1% and very few less than than 2%. The timing tables changed some too. As suspected the decel popping was always present from about 1800 on down.
Now, the map FM sent me is in closed loop AFR (14.6 -cruising range) Following what you have suggested on here (Dennis) I ended up richening the AFR to 13.8 @ 20kpa column 750-1500 rpm and 14.0 1500-4000. I also "smoothed" the 30 kpa column from 14.4 to 14.5 from 750 up to 4000. I then reduced the decel enleanment by 50% across the board. This has brought it down to an ever so slight gurgle at slowing down under closed throttle once in a while. if you have any more suggestions I'll keep working on that... All in all, it runs smooth and very strong.
Does it matter that the temps here were in the mid 40's (cold and less humid?) Would the next step be working on the AFR tables for cooling when it gets up into the 70's to 90's in the summer? I imagine that takes it out of closed loop (not that it matters?) I eventually want to end up with a good all around map.
** On a side note here i just took a look at the close loop bias in these maps and everything is set at 700 which to my understanding will put the actual AFR in the 14.3 range while the ECM is is "fooled" into thinking that it's 14.6. Can they be raised more if needed? I also got 40 mpg on the tankful of gas I used during the data log runs! not bad since I rode a little harder than I normally do :-) ...Hmm....I just may be good to go!
I was able to get 3 good logs in over the week-end to tweak the pre-loaded Fuel Moto map.
In the VE's there was about a 3-5% difference at 750 to 3500 rpm between the original map and the last run. There looked to a lot less betwwen the 2nd and 3rd runs...less than 1% and very few less than than 2%. The timing tables changed some too. As suspected the decel popping was always present from about 1800 on down.
Now, the map FM sent me is in closed loop AFR (14.6 -cruising range) Following what you have suggested on here (Dennis) I ended up richening the AFR to 13.8 @ 20kpa column 750-1500 rpm and 14.0 1500-4000. I also "smoothed" the 30 kpa column from 14.4 to 14.5 from 750 up to 4000. I then reduced the decel enleanment by 50% across the board. This has brought it down to an ever so slight gurgle at slowing down under closed throttle once in a while. if you have any more suggestions I'll keep working on that... All in all, it runs smooth and very strong.
Does it matter that the temps here were in the mid 40's (cold and less humid?) Would the next step be working on the AFR tables for cooling when it gets up into the 70's to 90's in the summer? I imagine that takes it out of closed loop (not that it matters?) I eventually want to end up with a good all around map.
** On a side note here i just took a look at the close loop bias in these maps and everything is set at 700 which to my understanding will put the actual AFR in the 14.3 range while the ECM is is "fooled" into thinking that it's 14.6. Can they be raised more if needed? I also got 40 mpg on the tankful of gas I used during the data log runs! not bad since I rode a little harder than I normally do :-) ...Hmm....I just may be good to go!
#1717
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Everything sounds good from your description above. When the temps get higher you could switch to an open loop map if you wanted but give the one you developed a try first. I run an open loop map in my bike. As for the CLB, the range of the stock O2 sensors is pretty limited. If CLB is set to 450, the bike will run closed loop at 14.68. Setting it to 700 makes that about 14.63. I would not recommend going much over 750 (14.58) in the CLB table. If you really want to run richer, change the AFR table to open loop. I run my CLB table set to 700 when I use closed loop.
#1718
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You can tune the closed loop cells using the stock O2 sensors, then change the AFR table to let's say 13.8 and the bike will calculate the correct fuel mixture based on the VEs you set during tuning.
#1719
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Hey guys,
I'm new to the PV. I just got one from Fuel Moto with the Autotune.
I'm still trying to figure it out with the tuning.
When I read on this thread on page 104 post# 1036 I saw a few guys complaining about the anti-knock feature possibly not working properly.
That made me think of the post I put up the other day about the NGK Iridium plugs.
Could this be the problem?
I sent an email to Jamie and also posted this question up on the Fuel Moto thread under sponsors with no answer so far.
Here is the post:
I was really interested in these plugs, till I did some internet research and found this:
I'm new to the PV. I just got one from Fuel Moto with the Autotune.
I'm still trying to figure it out with the tuning.
When I read on this thread on page 104 post# 1036 I saw a few guys complaining about the anti-knock feature possibly not working properly.
That made me think of the post I put up the other day about the NGK Iridium plugs.
Could this be the problem?
I sent an email to Jamie and also posted this question up on the Fuel Moto thread under sponsors with no answer so far.
Here is the post:
I was really interested in these plugs, till I did some internet research and found this:
Little known fact:
2005 and later Harley-Davidson EFI systems incorporate an "Anti-knock" feature that operates by reading the current resistance through the spark plugs.
The use of any other spark plug other than 'Stock' (6R12) disables the anti-knock feature.
(Yes, that means the Gold, Platinum and SE plugs will also disable this function)
Here is the website I got that info from:
http://www.harleyhelp.com/sparkplg.html
2005 and later Harley-Davidson EFI systems incorporate an "Anti-knock" feature that operates by reading the current resistance through the spark plugs.
The use of any other spark plug other than 'Stock' (6R12) disables the anti-knock feature.
(Yes, that means the Gold, Platinum and SE plugs will also disable this function)
Here is the website I got that info from:
http://www.harleyhelp.com/sparkplg.html
Here is the Thread that was started on it:
https://www.hdforums.com/forum/softai...ark-plugs.html
Is this true?
That any spark plug that is not stock (6R12) has a different resistance and will disable or give false readings to the anti-knock feature?
https://www.hdforums.com/forum/softai...ark-plugs.html
Is this true?
That any spark plug that is not stock (6R12) has a different resistance and will disable or give false readings to the anti-knock feature?
#1720
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Hey guys,
I'm new to the PV. I just got one from Fuel Moto with the Autotune.
I'm still trying to figure it out with the tuning.
When I read on this thread on page 104 post# 1036 I saw a few guys complaining about the anti-knock feature possibly not working properly.
That made me think of the post I put up the other day about the NGK Iridium plugs.
Could this be the problem?
I sent an email to Jamie and also posted this question up on the Fuel Moto thread under sponsors with no answer so far.
Here is the post:
I was really interested in these plugs, till I did some internet research and found this:
I'm new to the PV. I just got one from Fuel Moto with the Autotune.
I'm still trying to figure it out with the tuning.
When I read on this thread on page 104 post# 1036 I saw a few guys complaining about the anti-knock feature possibly not working properly.
That made me think of the post I put up the other day about the NGK Iridium plugs.
Could this be the problem?
I sent an email to Jamie and also posted this question up on the Fuel Moto thread under sponsors with no answer so far.
Here is the post:
I was really interested in these plugs, till I did some internet research and found this:
Little known fact:
2005 and later Harley-Davidson EFI systems incorporate an "Anti-knock" feature that operates by reading the current resistance through the spark plugs.
The use of any other spark plug other than 'Stock' (6R12) disables the anti-knock feature.
(Yes, that means the Gold, Platinum and SE plugs will also disable this function)
Here is the website I got that info from:
http://www.harleyhelp.com/sparkplg.html
2005 and later Harley-Davidson EFI systems incorporate an "Anti-knock" feature that operates by reading the current resistance through the spark plugs.
The use of any other spark plug other than 'Stock' (6R12) disables the anti-knock feature.
(Yes, that means the Gold, Platinum and SE plugs will also disable this function)
Here is the website I got that info from:
http://www.harleyhelp.com/sparkplg.html
Here is the Thread that was started on it:
https://www.hdforums.com/forum/softai...ark-plugs.html
Is this true?
That any spark plug that is not stock (6R12) has a different resistance and will disable or give false readings to the anti-knock feature?
https://www.hdforums.com/forum/softai...ark-plugs.html
Is this true?
That any spark plug that is not stock (6R12) has a different resistance and will disable or give false readings to the anti-knock feature?
Not true,
All years of harley EFI's have that feature, but a different plug "might" change
when it sees a knock, because of a different resitance of that plug. But thats been hard to prove that a different plug is causing a problem with this feature.