Has anyone used the Twin Scan 88 + to tune thier Power Commander Map? I'm thinking about getting one. I live in an area where there isn't a Dyno Tuning Center I would trust to tune it. Also wouldn't have to pay the Dyno guy to retune for future upgrades. I have a couple questions for anyone that has used one. The Power commander maps use TPS and RPM as a base for the fuel table cells. The Twin scan software allows you to display two different logs. Seems you would need the TPS, RPM and AFR to adjust a cell in the map. You would have to know what the ARF was at a given TPS and RPM to know if you needed to add or subtract from the value in that cell. Am I correct? Does the software display this info somewhere and I'm just missing it looking at the sample files? Also what effect does an increase of say 5 in the cell value have on the AFR. Is the percent increase in AFR the same for a given increase in cell value across all other TPS and RPM cells? I'm sure you could tune it by a hit or miss method of just changing values and looking at the AFR, wondering if someone has a better method.


Thanks

 

I'm not sure that there is a direct correlation between AFR and Torque/Horsepower at the very detailed end of things. If you are tuning for fuel efficieny, then you could set the PC for AFR only. Note also that you can tune each cylinder independently. You can tune for every 250 rpm block, too. That means taking 40 readings and tweaking, then taking 40 more, etc. if you want to be really over the top on it.

The PC changes by 1/10 of a percent for each press of the page down key, I believe. That's a pretty fine adjustment to read using an AFR sensor stuck in the exhaust pipe. A built in 02 sensor would be more reliable...

If the software would record data that is put out by the PC III >AND< the ECM on a bike with an o2 sensor or an AFR meter, then you might be able to reduce the effort that would be required. I don't know if the Daytona product does this (haven't looked).

Me, I used a map from someone else that had their bike dyno'd with exactly the same setup as mine. I know, based upon my gas mileage, that it is still richer (and thus safer for my engine) than I might eventually end up with. So, I'm going to take it to a dyno shop... I know where there is one that is a nice ride from where I live.

I figure $150 for every performance change that I'm going to make (they will be more drastic than just Air Cleaner/Pipes after this) isn't that big a deal in the overall cost of stuff from HD. Probably a much better value per dollar for that matter, eh?

C#

 

I talked with Chris at Daytona Twin Tec this afternoon. He's interested in developing a software package for the Twin Scan 88+ that could be used with the Power Commander. If it showed the AFR at a certain % throttle opening and RPM it would just be a matter of adjusting the values to correct the AFR. Sounds like it will be very interesting to see what happens.

 

I used the twinscan88 wego to tune my 06 Bob with the SERT, what it does is compare the actual afr against what the ecm is calling for and gives you a comparison telling you what cells to change and by what percentage in the VE tables, I am very happy with the results, although I thought it was very time consuming. You still need to decide what afr you want at any given throttle postion/load and you will also need to map the timing. I would think it would not be to big of a stretch for the company to make this compatible with the PCIII.

 

I think it's just a chance in the way the software displays the collected data. The new verison will use a USB interface rather than the current serial. Lots of Power Commanders out there, gives everyone another option.

 

BVBOB, thanks for the info on the wego. I am waiting to buy one in October that will incorporate two O2 sensors rather than one. Does this unit also help you adjust the timing or is it simply reading your AFR and suggesting what changes need to be made for a richer or leaner conditon and the timing is up to you? Thanks

 

Sorry I didn't see your post on this sooner, you will have to do the timing tables yourself, I basically ride my bike solo so I advanced the timing until it shows up in the data collection as retarding the timing and then back it off in those areas a little from there to avoid detonation, On a big heavy bike that does not get the same airflow over the cylinders which could make it run hotter plus the fact of it being heavier and possibly loaded down every now and then I would be much more conservative on the timing, It is amazing though how much a couple of degrees in the right place can change the characteristics of the way the bike runs. I would guess you are going with the DTT ECM that runs two 02 sensors to fine tune your map, I would love to get a chance to play with one of these. I understand they are quite spendy though, somewhere around 750 to a grand?. If you would like a better explanation of what the hell I'm talking about feel free to PM me.

 

I have extensive hands on experience with the twin scan 88 especially tuning the closed loop bikes.

The software is designed to integrate to the factory ECU. It sniffs the exhaust mixture with a bosch wide band sensor and directly compares the reading to the target A/F ratio specified in the SERT map. The twin scan plugs into the ECU while the bike is operating. At the end of the day, the twin scan gives you several methods you could use to tune . One is the VE table correction table which would be utterly useless to tune a power commander (or would it?). The other is a chart view with several parameters that could be used to tune to a degree. I suppose you would have to tape off your throttle into 'map' quadrants and focus on small areas at a time and rev the bike with the clutch pulled in several times as a marker. Honestly, using the chart and graph view is really used to fine tune the excellent VE correction data.

The twin scan correction VE table correction data is displayed in percent. For the sert, that means 2 increments in the VE table equals one percent mixture change.

 

WoW..Sounds a bit complicated but I would rather do it myself rather than give the bike to some stranger who may or may not know how to operate a dyno.

 

Actually with the twinscan88 you can turn the ingnition on and twist the throttle without it running and get the readings off of the real time display to mark your throttle position, I believe you can do the same with the SERT data mode. As for the twinscan being complicated, it is really not that bad and the results are worth the time.