There are many differences in the MT7 and MT8 calibrations.

It is not the calibration that locks the ECM when flashed with the TTS it is the software version of Mastertune. All of this was done on purpose over 2 years ago.

Regardless of which "clone" calibration you use it will not be for your bike. Each bike breaths differently. You will still need to VTune and set the VE's.

Let's take a quote from Steve Cole (TTS Owner) when all this came to a head on another forum a few days ago.






« Reply #33 on: February 28, 2013, 09:35:42 PM »

First off let's talk about Warranty work. If you modified your engine with cam, heads exhaust or anything non stock HD as supplied your warranty is already in danger. Does not matter who's parts your talking about here. Now let's say you did modify your engine and it goes into the dealer and they reflash your ECM, there goes your custom tune out the window and most tuners have a hard time giving the tune to the customers for some reason. Now HD has a locked ECM to start with, why is that? To keep people out of them in the first place. The PV, SESPT, SEST or Mastertune are all treated the same when it comes to warranty coverage. PV gets hit the hardest as the screen mounted on the handle bars is a dead give away that the ECM has been modified, SESPT ans SEST both mark the ECM internally so it tells the dealership the ECM has been modified and that mark cannot be removed. As soon as the dealer tool gets plugged in it tells them the ECM is tuned and it gets added to you warranty record at HD! Why do you think that HD did that?

So the ECM is locked from the factory and has to be unlocked to be tuned. TTS has changed the lock for several reasons, the first and foremost reason is to keep the custom tunes from being screwed up at HD dealerships. Next on the list is that there are several areas in the ECM that can be adjusted and not all tuners are equal. Some tuners only replace 1 of 4 areas, so let's just say the ECM is tuned in all 4 areas and then someone comes along and uses another tuner on it and it screws the ECM up since they only changed 1 area and now it does match the other areas. Who fault is it? Bottom line here is that if you follow the directions the TTS system is much safer than anything else on the market as it prevents this from happening. How hard is it to take a copy of the ECM prior to programming it? Takes all of 1-2 minutes! Now once you have the saved file you can store it on our website so you can retrieve it anytime you like or you can store it anywhere you like on several computers and hard drives if that's what you want. Anytime you want to return it back you can. The dealership tools all work with anything other than reprogramming. The next software release for the Mastertune2 product will also store the saved files into the interface itself so you will have a copy there as well. Anyone who owns a Mastertune2 unit will be able to upgrade this feature into there unit for free. So the product saves the original file for you, we provide a free storage location on the Web for you and soon coming it will be stored into the interface too.

Now if you failed all that we can still help you but it requires the ECM to come to us so that we can remove the programming and return it to you. All you have to pay for is the shipping if we have to do this.

http://www.mastertune.net/repositary.php Tuning File Repository for file storage

All of this is being brought up now after it's been this way for near 2 years by people who are trying there best to make a mountain out of a mole hill, IMHO. Nothing more than trying to say the other competitors product is better when there is not one other unit on the market than can do what Mastertune does, when it comes to tuning and most of them have only tried to copy the Mastertune features but have been unable to perfect them. The self tuning was in Mastertune from 2008 when it was released to the public, now you have a copy in PV and SESPT but they still do not know how to or provided test tools to do EGR adjustments, cam adjustments and many other features that you get with all Mastertune products.

 

Mr Wizard I looked at that map and it's for shotgun/shorty dual exhaust thats ok? Will I need to make any change in CI. and in the cam settings? Stock injectors are 3.91? Decription on page 26 says race exchaust and on page 5 says something different.

 

Some say the Devil is in the details. When it comes to calibrations this is true IF you use a calibration that is too big for your mod combinations.

Don't worry about the exhaust, worry about the motor mods. Choose a calibration that is smaller than what you have is better than one that is made for a larger modified motor IMO.

Building a motor means you must work more closely with your calibration. IF your VE tables go to 125 then increase your CI to reduce the VE #'s. Then you must start tuning all over again. You can increase your CI to 110 to reduce your overall VE's when you first start. This will not upset the tune values but may save you some time.

Change the injector numbers to what you have. Probably 4.35. Remember this calibration started for the 06 bikes which used a smaller injector. TTS assumes you read the manual and make changes before you start to tune.

When tuning a 2-1 pipe you will see very low numbers in the lower RPM's. This is due to the exhaust restriction (or lack of). The less restriction the less free oxygen your sensors will trace. It also depends on the sensor location and depth of the sensors in the pipe. Are the sensors in or near a turn in the pipe. All these variables come into play but on a 2-1 they will be vivid below 2800 RPM.

When you start to VTune you will see the VE 3-D graph gives you a dip then a huge upswing then dips again. This upswing will start at 2800 and carry on to about 3500 then drop again. THe upswing is where the pipe and cam will work the best and the downswing is where HP will come into play instead of TQ in your higher RPM's.

You can work with your EGR settings and CI to smooth some of this upswing out but you won't be able to smooth it all out so your 3-D looks like a summer pond. This just doesn't happen with a 2-1 build.

I know you don't quiet understand right now but as you get into this TTS and start to understand how it works, reacts and tunes you will see for the most part is it all logical. You must think like a computer to understand one.

Reading across different forums or white paper articles where different people have exchanged information can be very confusing. Not everyone agrees. It can get political and downright nasty at times. If in doubt go to the man. Ask the product owner or tech support. In this case it would be Steve Cole. Steve is busy building 66 new calibrations as we speak but if you send him an email or call the office he will talk to you. All business owners enjoy talking about the strengths of their produce. He is no different and may keep you on the phone for an hour and blow all this stuff right over your head. It's actually fun !

Here is a short tune I did for another member here. SG/103/555 cams/ 2-1 pipe. It's called a short tune because the higher RPM's and kPa were not tuned properly due to time. If you click on a VE table then 3-D Graph you will see a little of what I'm talking about.

Caution... this calibration is not intended to be used for any other bike. All bikes breath differently. The settings in this calibration may damage your engine components. This is NOT a clone calibration for your use. YOU use it, YOU blow it, it's on YOU.


https://www.box.com/s/so7fhgfqk2dn5kbfmlcj

 

Dave,
Looks pretty damn good for a "short tune". I went through all the tables and that graph looks excellent.
Buddy....

 

Check the Lambda. Don't really like running that rich at low RPM's/Idle but his bike stumbled before... doesn't now. Also didn't want the 2-1 to effect the ALV's and overwrite the VE's down low.

Thanks for the comments Buddy. He still needs to get it to a Dyno for high RPM/kPa testing to hit the areas where he can't ride... therefore, "short tune".

 

Mr. Wizard, what would bve a good starting map for a setup of mine being a 2012 street glide with after market exhaust (kuryaken power dual w/mellow crushers) street sleeper intake.

 

https://www.box.com/s/x2y3x3y7ecu7t5wr1a80


This will be a lot closer than any calibration you will get from your supplier.

It's a standard 2012Touring/103/stockcam/nocat/AC/2.0 baffle change MT8 that I did several months ago. Again, short tune but he's been riding with it and doesn't want to change it.


Start with this and VTune it to your bike.

 

why is it that no one messes with the throttle control percentages???

 

Why should one mess with them?


Reason... most think by increasing the throttle tables to max will give them real cable feel. It's close but much more sensitive than a cable bike.

Riding a loaded throttle table will give you a jerky feeling. Take a bumpy road and your hand twists just a little then hopefully you are holding on real tight with the other hand. It's worse when you are at low speeds such as in a parking lot. Slow maneuvers need good low end manners from the bike.

I do increase the 100 column a little in some calibrations. It all depends on the bike and riding style. A good tuner tunes a bike to run efficiently and to the riding style of the owner. If a tuner has no wishes to discuss your tune before he does his magic, walk away.

 

do u have any good map suggestions for a 2012 triglide with hd heavy breather,tts, and decatted??? stock mufflers..
burgie