I think Glen’s assessment is probably right on based on my personal experience with the IEDs and XIEDs. I went from a PCIII, K&N air cleaner and Rush slip-ons to my present set up of Screaming Eagle street legal slip-ons and IEDs. I tried the XIEDs and didn’t like them and went back to the IEDs. My bike runs better now than it ever has. I think your expectations should be a cooler running engine and maybe smoother acceleration with no surging. Also the slip-ons seem to sound a little deeper due to the richer mixture.

 

I'm not an advocate for Xied's, but I did have the local H-D shop do a before and after dyno run, with no other changes to the bike. I posted the dyno chart here afterward. You can see it in 'my pictures' by clicking on my moniker.

You can also see I changed to the TTS MasterTune after doing the stage 1 thing.

Steve

 

I'd say that's a pretty significant increase in torque and HP:

 

I have a pair of originals and Xieds that I used on my 08 and now have an 09 are the originals equal to the x14s or 02s ????

 

The originals are the 02s.

 

How do you account for such a significant performance increase?. Stands to reason that if the ieds were capable of such a result, nightrider would be making claims about it. And as you pointed out they were only designed to make the bike run cooler, hence no dyno testing/results by nightrider.

Moving on to the cooling issue. If the product does indeed make the bike run cooler why aren't there any testing results of that so buyers have some idea what sort of typical reduction in temp they can expect to achieve. Instead seems all I've seen to date is testimonial evidence.

 

I'd bet it's likely the air flow was changed at the same time. I.e. intake/exhaust mods.

 

The information you seek is at this link:

http://www.nightrider.com/parts/ied_product_line.htm

There is then another whole discussion on narrow band versus wide band O2 sensor.

 

Thanks eddfive, I stand corrected.

 

How much running time on the bike before the second dyno run? If it was immediately after installation (or if the first one was immediately after de-installation) they are invalid. The ECU needs a good cross-section of actual-usage run-time to get the AFVs where they need to be when changes like this are made to the system.

That brings to mind one of the arguments in favor of the *IEDs ("*" being a wildcard covering all models). It went something like "If you don't notice a difference after putting them on, just take them off after riding a while and notice the immediate [less-desirable] difference that way." That's invalid. The closest way to doing a valid comparison would be to reset the AFVs at the time of the change, either direction. This would get you "apples to apples," but the apples aren't ripe yet. They need time to ripen before actual measurements can be taken, and making the change and resetting the AFVs makes the apple green again each time. So now, great care must be taken in duplicating the environmental conditions each time a test is performed, after the AFVs have settled the same amount in each configuration.

Funny, the nightrider link in the post just above shows "yes" for compatibility with "Exhaust and/or Air Cleaner upgrades". The footnote for that "yes" says "Tested configurations and results by independent riders can be found at HDForums.com IED thread." THIS VERY THREAD. If this thread points to that web page for something which that web page points to this thread, well, I guess that'd be the textbook definition of "circular reasoning."

Footnote 15 there says "Tuning Guidelines for using the O2 IED with the Power Commander are available." I don't know where; it doesn't say. I'll give them here so the circular reasoning can be more complete:

+ perform any (or none) breathing modifications to your bike

+ install Power Commander and reset Delphi AFVs to 100%

+ put bike on dyno or use a TwinScan II+ and tune, as best you can using the PC tables, all of the throttle-position/MAP cells in your stock (or current) Delphi AFR tables to match the AFR value they contain (good luck knowing what/where they all are!) [note that this will be very tough to do, if not nigh unto impossible to do completely correct]

+ install *IEDs (or LC-1s) in place of the PC "O2 eliminators"

+ operate engine in sufficient areas to establish new AFVs

+ re-tune PC map in any areas of operation which are open-loop and have become richer than you'd previously tuned

The trick is to get the tune, after your mods, back to exactly what the current Delphi programming supplies. This will accurately accommodate your mods and only then allow for non-use of the PC "O2 eliminators". If you don't do this you'll be in for a world of dissatisfaction. I've toyed with a PC in service along with the O2 sensors on-line. It gets ugly very quickly when just done haphazardly.