Wow!

I have family who've been "over" the vice-president in terms of actual "leadership" (mayor of where they lived), and have taken OSHA to task in Senate hearings (another family member; really kicked OHSA's *** in the hearings; have a PDF transcript if you're interested). I have been reserving judgment on you, not knowing if you were some sort of "actual" tester or maybe a janitor who's listened in on conversations while emptying the trash. But a response like that makes me not want to even care what your standing is in the environment in which you earn your paycheck.

I never said it would be the most cost-effective. Merely that it would be the most correct. If you can't even acknowledge that fact, much less denigrate me for saying it, I have to say I don't care what you have to say about anything.

I have spoken the truth throughout on this subject. Can't you even lower yourself to acknowledge that fact? Why must you throw jabs at me that way?

If you'd ever even acknowledged one of my private e-mails, much less answered them, I might have a different opinion of you. As it stands now, you'll have to earn respect if you want it. My default is to give full respect and subtract as necessary. I've given up on you now. Earn it if you want it. Otherwise, shut the hell up if you can't provide positive proof what I'm saying is incorrect.

 

Yes and no. Most of us are more familiar with "automotive" EFI, which for the vast majority has utilized Mass Air Flow sensors for many years now. With a MAF, any changes you make to the system will automatically be picked up everywhere and you can hardly go wrong. With our bikes, a MAF is not currently "usable" since they are typically a heated resistive element which is cooled by the air flow. They are way too fragile for mounting on a vibrating 45° v-twin. In our cars/trucks they are mounted on the chassis-end of the snorkel from the airbox to the throttle body. Where there is a much more stable environment and they can survive much longer. If we had that technology this entire discussion would be moot.

Very correct.

Your are entirely correct in that first analysis.

To the second, the most I can manage on a typical day is something like maybe 50 words per minute. It depends on what the subject matter is. "Normal conversation" will be at the higher end of the scale. Programming languages will usually be somewhat less. But with just about any environment other than MS Windows (of any flavor) the "cut and paste" stuff is much easier to use. No keywork involved; just a dragged left-mouse-button to highlight the text and a middle-mouse-button click to paste it.

 

Thank you! I'm vindicated, if nothing else. All of the possibilities you presented use the stock airbox. A couple of them have stock mufflers and a couple have SE mufflers.

Whatever else they're doing with those programming loads, the different mufflers in and of themselves require different calculations.

Airbox changes are yet another can of worms.

 

Those programs don't tell me anything!


Or, is the Stage 1 something entirely different altogether? No on will tell you, let alone the differences or what it is really changing. Granted, other than a completely different ECM that is truly programmable in every sense, in conjunction with a Dyno, is nothing more than a band-aid at best. I am amazed that there isn't some HD tech on this board who knows whats going on to inform us. I find this sort of sad, but by the same token, I don't think they would really know either.

This thread has finally made the big 300, maybe it's time to stick a fork in it!

 

Thanks Glens...now that I have all this figured out, I'm going to start my own tuning business.............Hahahahahahaha..PS I only type @ 5 words per minute with mistakes.

 

Difference in HP or temp. or emissions or what?

 

Glens, we have all had our moments up here where we dissagree with each other. I have to say that when I read this post from you to Rider57 I was in shock to say the least.

You said, "shut the hell up if you can't provide positive proof what I'm saying is incorrect". I am surprised to see this type of remark coming from you. It's not something I would expect to see. With your superior command of the English language I'm just surprised that this is all you could think of saying.

I believe Rider57 did show proof of what he is saying. After all he is a professional who works in an EPA Lab testing engines all day. I've had the honor of meeting the Man in person, he's the real deal.

Looking at the information that his post provides and then looking at your response which is really no more than a Filibuster. I would say that you are the one who is lacking proof of what you are saying. You have talked in circles since you first took over this post. Never providing any type of proof.

What does ones stand on the Environment have to do with anything we are discussing? You can't tell me your honestly trying to conserve the environment. The fact that you have altered your O2 emissions is quite the contrary. But you are not alone in this category. I am just as guilty as you are. I just don't understand what this has to do with anything discussed up to this point.

Rider57 is the real deal. He has a real degree and works on Motor Vehicles (Motorcycles included) for the purpose of testing them for the EPA. I've met the Man in person and he is genuine.

He simply gave his opinion based on the testing of over a dozen Bikes as to the value of a stage one download. It's not worth the cost.

But instead of coming back and showing us the proof as to why it is worth the money, you talk about everything but the subject in question. A typical tactic of someone who has run out of things to say and has nothing to contribute.

What makes you an expert? What degrees do you possess, and from what learning institutions? What real hands on experience do you have wrenching on a Motorcycle? Or are you simply a graduate of Barnes and Nobles Institution? A Book learner?

You said, "shut the hell up if you can't provide positive proof what I'm saying is incorrect".

Maybe you should heed your own advice.

 

glens - no slamming was intended. I simply stated what our testing has revealed. There is no cost benefit of a stage 1 download with or without the recommended parts matched to it. Anything else would require a sert or TTS, TTS being the better choice. You have stated you point time and time again. Numerous replies to you from many have asked you to get to the particular point you are trying to make or get off the soap box. As far as your "repeated emails" to me, I have asked you via PM to please resend them. Nada, zip, zilch. If all of the posts you have made were email, they would probably qualify as SPAM because of the repetative wording. Believe me, we understand what you are stating, we just dont see the point to it all!

 

Well stated, Thank You Rider57

 

Off topic switch on: 3000 !!