&nbsp\\;
Glens, not to be argumentative, but your statement about the "normal" IEDS is not correct. My bike is bone stock and I have been running the IEDs for 500+ miles. No SERT, no PC-III, no dyno, no analysis, no pipes, etc. I get the 131/151 codes without a check engine light. I'm sticking with the IEDs. My bike runs great\\; cooler, and more responsive. If someone shows me that they're doing harm, then I'll take 'em off. Otherwise, I've cleared the codes and aren't sweating them.
&nbsp\\;
Joe

 

You are assuming the engineers at Delphi do not know what they are doing.

Have a look through their site and you will see that the engine management in use by H-D is a product in the Delphi small engine lineup. It is not part of their automotive gear.

The lambda sensors do not have a clock time. They are analog devices. There is extensive documentation available at the Delphi site.

I am not discounting your findings that by changing your test equipment sampling rate results in different readings. But it is immaterial. Just for kicks look up the word dither some time. What you are doing is affecting your instrumentation only.

Whether the engine is brand spanking new or has 100,000 miles on it, should make no difference except for perhaps the relative condition of the lambda sensor.

The (ECU) codes are results of the lambda sensor operating outside its linear range, and that because its output is being modified between it and the sampling unit (ECU).

Making that statement shows that you do not understand why H-D said what they said (in a non-technical manner) relative to the break-in period. Most of the H-D field technicians would not understand the full explanation which is why the memo does not even bother with elaboration.

Possibly. But totally irrelevant to the discussion at hand.

Again, possibly, but totally irrelevant. Actually, there should be no swing value. Since there is no value to swing. The sampling source has been eliminated but the sampling unit does not know that.

What? The faster the clock on the ECU the better the resolution. It does not matter how many cylinders there are. By the way, if you would check the documentation, you would see that the lambda sensor does not put out a constant voltage anyway. Its output voltage is representative of the (relatively) instantaneous condition of its environment.

 

&nbsp\\; I installed a set of XIED'S just to see if all I was reading was true. Some of the temp reductions I was reading were to good to be true and were twice or more what even nightride claimed.
So on a stock 07 RoadGlide with 16,000 miles on it and bike running just fine I installed the Xied's.
heres the way I see it.
They lower engine temp slightly about 20 degrees running down the road in 6th gear at highyway speeds. The difference has to be measured it not enought were you can feel it.
About 20 degree drop.
Hot idle in closed area outside temp about 85-90.
Bike was a bit cooler for about 4 minutes then started to rise. It then held temp and at 7 minutes came back down a bit. The difference was about 20 degrees.
The bike did respond a little bit better to roll on at 60 in sixth gear and seems to start a bit quicker when warmed up.
The Xieds's do some good but no were near some of the post you read about them.
I plan to leave them on for a while and see how they do longer term.
Two other things I notice the exhaust pipes my bike the left side tail pipe always has had a slight carbon dusting on it the right was clean, now the right side has started to show a slight dusting also. This is a sign of richer fuel.
&nbsp\\; If I take the bike out and as they say ride it like I stole it for a bit in short quick curves up and down the full rpm range quicky I do&nbsp\\;get a small amount of back fire once in awhile.
This can be explaned by extra fuel in exhaust firing off in the pipes not big deal. The bike never did that befor so this to is a sign of higher ATF mixture.
So from my point of view they do seem to work as NightRide cliams, but no were near some of the over the top claims you may read about them.
XIED's adjust ATF to 13.8:1

 

....XIED's adjust ATF to 13.8:1...
&nbsp\\;
The catch is +/- some range due to the exhaust temp variation.
&nbsp\\;
And +/- some range due to the dithering/sampling rates and other things in the software logic.
&nbsp\\;
We tend to ride these bikes in&nbsp\\;55 to 95 outside air temps and relitivly low on the powerband so exhaust temp variation may be small enough that this is not an issue from the drivers seat.
&nbsp\\;
13.8 +/- some range may be undetectable from the drivers seat and 14.7 +/- the same amount may be an issue from a dirvability standpoint.
&nbsp\\;
AW

 

Same experience here. Little cooler, little smoother. It does what Nightrider says it will do. Some of the euphoric comments,&nbsp\\;\\\\\\;almost like&nbsp\\;\\\\\\;you would get a big bloc V8, are creating false expectations. For 100 dollars and&nbsp\\;\\\\\\;15 minutes work you get more results/dollar than any other solution. And easy to undo.
Greetings,
Low cost, Maximum pleasure

 

We are getting way off the thread topic here. Email or PM and I will explain it and the test.

 

Just checked with our contact at the MOCO about the O2 specs currently installed on 2007 and 08 models. (His answers jive with our data and thier filing for certification.)
&nbsp\\;
1. There is no pre-heat for the O2 sensor. The sensor will not start heating until the engine is running and then will be fully operational within 10 seconds. Older systems that enabled the pre-heat caused failures of the O2 sensors.
2. When asked about the "swings" that some are seeing from data logs, he stated that they ignore those readings as most are too eratic for the system to adjust instantly.
3. The specs for the O2 sensors currently installed have a variance of .75 volt as the systems used on the bikes have differences that can and do make it impossible to get exacting for a device and get it to work properly.

 

Not sure who your contact is, but if he said the O2 sensors would be ready in 10 seconds after start he needs to talk to the engineers doing the work.&nbsp\\; It takes 60-90 seconds for an unheated sensor to be ready and fully functional.&nbsp\\; These are 2 wire sensors with no heat...just exhaust gases.

 

Yep,&nbsp\\; I see o2s going active in 90 to 100 sec.
&nbsp\\;
AW

 

I in no way think they would cause harm.

The way I understand things, the hi/lo codes are thrown when the adaptive fuel routine reaches its limits. The only times I have ever gotten them in 13,000 miles on my 07 is when I have had the leads totally disconnected while the engine was running.

I cannot fathom how all you folks are content with the stock mufflers. Apart from the first week I had the bike putting 1100 miles on it, the only time I have run the stock mufflers was one day riding around for a while to reset the AFVs and it was TOTALLY embarrassing.

As it is, my 2" Rush cans are almost too quiet.

Anyway, back on topic.

Are you saying that with the "mild" EIDs you continually throw the codes or was it just the first time while the ECU was establishing new AFVs? Do you constantly take them in and out of service and get the codes the first times running after the changes? Like I said, the only times I have ever gotten them was while running the engine with no connection on the ECU leads to the sensors.