Sorry, I was referring to the old SE Pro Super Tuner. The one Harley use to sell and our bikes came with. It didn't have all the parameters available with PV or TTS but was quite a capable tuner.
The newer street tuners are worthless and a waste of money. Including this newest one.

 

Those that are bashing Harley for selling only an EPA compliant tuner need to write your congressperson. They are selling what the can legally sell. I’m sure the time is coming where no one will be able to sell a non EPA tuner. But, get them while you can.

 

I agree. It is not their fault. It is the EPA. A $30,000,000 fine will do that...

 

Now it is so castrated. It only needs an app to control it.

 

People really pile on the ignorance and then repeat without understanding anything or defining anything. Using these together doesn't allow anything. If base parameters are outside of what the calibration allows. You are not going to get the bike in a good state of tune. If a VE cell needs to add 20% to the value, and the cal only allows 10%. How is reading it with a wide band vs a narrow band? How does the cam being made by an aftermarket cam grinder affect this?

I would also love someone to define a "EPA Tune" vs a "full race tune" Because in my experience of tuning street bikes and race bikes. I have never targeted as rich as the SE tuner does at 100kpa for pump gas fuel for best power or have I ever seen their targeted fuel achieved best power over shooting for a leaner mixture.

Please, before anyone posted up the SE target table that shows "lean" across the board. Remember that there are other enrichment tables that we cannot see in the SE calibrations. So, these tables also need to be added to on top of the target the main table calls out for. Since SE does not show anything about PE mode. What activates it, when, what deactivates it and when. What is the target of this table? HD has put more strategy into PE mode over the older models. Seems they have went from adding fuel for temp management as a long term hold of an RPM to an actual power enrichment mode that is very familiar in the auto world.

How many people out their racing their harley and want that full race tune? Enough for someone to base their shop on it in the STL area and be successful for over 15 years.

 

so I have read thru this whole thread and still unsure how to proceed. any advice is much appreciated.

picked up my 22 roadglide special 2 weeks ago
this new M8 already seems to run stronger than my old stage 4 twin cam, could just be the 'new' tho, I dunno
wanting to go to stage 1 and 99.999% sure no further.. been there done that just wanna ride (mostly, won't rule out occasional burnout or gettin on it)
already has Rinehart slip ons
I decided I liked one of the Arlen Ness breathers, and it's on the way
I have 3 year warranty and I don't want to screw with that

I blew the budget this month on getting the bike to look how I want, so I won't be able to do anything till next month at the earliest.

I was thinking I would get the SE tuner and associated cable. that combo is still a little cheaper than getting the new bluetooth one. I am not sure if any additional function in the new tuner over the old cabled one... I am not interested in looking at my damn phone any more than I have to. the 'ride for 20 minutes in learn mode, then create/download new tune' thing on the old tuner appealed to me cause I understand it

what's a feller to do? thanks in advance for any advice or words of wisdom.

 

If you want warranty and only some slip ons. I would go HD and look into a simple download. Then when you decide on a cam. Look into the TTS.

 

For what it's worth I'll put this up. My best friend just picked up a 22 Road Glide with the 117 engine in it. It had the HD forward facing air cleaner on it stock and stock mufflers, He hated the sound(of course, very quiet), I got the SE tuner in case, and got a set of Khrome Werks mufflers for him.. put the bike up on the dyno to get baseline data, both 100% in 4th,5th,amd 6th.(he already had 1500 miles on it so i would call it broken in before testing). I also then did loaded steady state tests simulating part throttle cuise condiditons a serveral different speeds in a few different gears.
Then took off the stock mufflers and put on the new ones,,,,,did each test again, exactly as it was done originally,,,,EVERY graph overlayed the others like there was minimal or NO change done...I was truly suprised by this, but it is what it is sooo...looks like i get to save the SE Tuner untill I put a FullSac headpipe on it for him.
m

 

my 114 road glide special came with that ventilator open air filter, but with paper filter. I just wonder how much more, if any, the arlen ness inverted sucker I want will flow and/or affect AFR. I suspect not much impact, but don't want to take any chances leaning it out too much either, so I probably will not install the new air cleaner until I can afford to go get the SE tuner. Bike runs fine now, I am just updating the air cleaner for looks.

 

If you didn't remove or improve the choke point. I have great luck with KW's and have proven to support power. I would really like to see the next step of decatting the stock header and then FullSac's. I have seen a decatted head pipe support 140hp