Hi. I also just posted a new thread in the drive/transmission section on the one-piece inner primary bearing. I installed one last year, and now with about 4500 miles on the bike since, I began to hear a howl from the bike at about 50 MPH. No oil leaks but tore it down to check things out. The one-pice bearing seems to be getting ready to fail, feels kind of "notchy" when I spin it with my fingers. When installing it, I removed the seals as suggested by some guys (online posts) and I am wondering if that helped to cause the problem, or if the bearings are just poor quality. I really like the idea of being able to take the inner primary off without needing the puller/install tooling for the inner race (stock set-up), and would lean toward trying the one-piece design again WITH the seals left in, just for convenience sake and speed (I have a new set ready to go in my saddlebag). If anyone that has some experience with this mod could chime in and talk about their experience with it, I'd really like to hear it. Thanks, nevadarider

 

One problem I see in this is if ever the bearing was to ever fail and lock up, it would take out transmission input shaft. However, I have see the same application where the load on the shaft is all there was to latch on the inner race and spin the bearing.

Think Harley designers where just to old school for this. Plus if you have the proper tools, pulling the race and pressing it on is no big deal. Obviously, you must have a belt drive primary drive. Not sure what the seal would have to do with it since the Baker bearing is sealed. Surely with a rubber seal. If you still had a chain and oil, it really ought to be a shielded bearing with metal shields. These seal out metal but will seep oil. The rubber seals seal out all and hold in grease.

Toyota runs shielded bearings in there manual transmissions.. I have popped the shield off to inspect bearing to find them still in good shape, with little grease left since it was washed out but covered in 79-90 SYN oil. Oil is a much more reliable lubricant then grease.

You are the first person I have ever see report a bearing failure of this type. Sure Baker would like to hear this if it was theirs. They make good stuff. That is not enough miles for a failure and sure they will make it good .

 

Hi Thanks for your input. The kit I put in was an AllBalls kit. I have a new kit in my saddlebags and just looked at the bearing. It is marked KML, and no origin marked on it. I researched a little, and it looks like KML is a chinese bearing company. Maybe that is the problem. I just ordered the Jim's set-up and it is supposed to be USA made. I'm going to be guinea pig on this one and try the Jim's set up.
I have an '04 touring, and still have wet (chain) primary, with a hayden spring-type automatic adjuster. The reason I like the idea of being able to pull the inner primary housing off without a puller/install tool is just because of the weight factor. I have the puller/install tools but they aren't light. I do carry enough tools to do a lot of roadside repairs if necessary. I just don't like feeling "helpless" on the road, and will tackle most anything if I feel I have a chance to fix my problem. I must already carry 30-40 lbs of tools/repair items or more as it is! Not much room for any other "stuff" in the saddlebags.
So, with all that said, would you leave the (rubber) seals in the bearings, or take them out? The seals are there in case of application for dry primary, but would it be better to leave them in in your opinion?
Thanks my friend. nevadarider

 

OK, I misread your original post and assumed you were running a belt drive and referring to removing the outer seal in the inner primary cover. WOW..need to get my cataracts fixed bad. Any way, just my opinion but some of what I said applies here. Hope from my post two that you understand the difference in a sealed bearing and a shielded bearing. The original inner primary bearing is a huge roller pin bearing that can take the trash in the primary case

I really do not think a ball bearing can handle this. It would take little to skate the ball rollers. However, since they are getting an oil bath, I guess they would still take a while to tear them up. If it was me, I would run the seal in the bearing. Personally, think it would be best as a shielded bearing for long life.

I am not too fond of the spring or auto chain tensioners. I had three of the REV B tensioners. Installed one and was paid to take it back out. Sold one and that person took it out. I finally put one in mine and after a while it appeared too tight. Pulled the cover and realized it still had about 3/8 more play then I thought since you really have to push hard to see the play in the two heavy coil springs. By then, I just said screw it and put my manualy one back in.

The manual one is best for a Harley. If you have a few miles on a harley, the primary chain wears uneven and you get long and shot sections that appears as runout You can set the manual for the tight. Auto ones jump tighter to the loose and then are a little too tight if you really get bike hot. (transmission gets further away in a hot condition) Only problem is they called for all the checks which is manual one.. They really change little. Mine has move one notch in 45K miles. Once they wear in enough for the chain to roll on roller, it would never wear anymore.

 

Thanks Ripsaw. I think you are right about the bearing. I'll run it with the seals in it and if there are no apparent issues this season, I will open things up for a look during the off season. It will be interesting to see if the US made bearing holds up better than the chinese one.

I'll also consider the change back to the manual chain adjuster, but so far I don't think the Hayden one is causing any issue at all. I have had one in my old Evo Dyna for about 10 years. They are a type that only has a single coil spring. On the twin cam, I could hear a buzz sound after I first put it in, but I think that it was breaking in the plastic wear shoe. That sound faded out fairly quickly and that area has been pretty quiet until the IPB starting singing.

Thanks again for your input. If this thread is still viewable this winter, I will post the findings I have on this after I look in there to see what happens. We riders ought to share the results of our trials on parts/methods we try out. It just makes the overall health of riding them HD beasts more bearable and interesting. (IMHO)

 

Thanks for the input on the sealed bearings for the primary, I have to replace my clutch and comp last winter and considered one. Ultimately, I decided against it due to some of the inherent flaws of sealed bearings: the fact that they are sealed... I felt like the constant flow of fresh lubrication would be better in the long run.

 

You're sure correct on this. Rarely do you get people answering back what fixed their question. However, most carry it in and mechanics don't like to say what they do. Like Aunt Betty recipes I guess.


[QUOTE=nevadarider;14052641 If this thread is still viewable this winter, I will post the findings I have on this after I look in there to see what happens. We riders ought to share the results of our trials on parts/methods we try out. It just makes the overall health of riding them HD beasts more bearable and interesting. (IMHO)[/QUOTE]

 

Perhaps things have changed at Jims, but I ordered my one-piece inner primary bearing from Jims two years ago, and they got it from AllBalls. I know that because I asked them the question about removing one of the side shields, and their response after a few days was "AllBalls says it doesn't matter."

I removed one of the side shields & have been running it thusly ever since. About 25K mi, no problems so far. I would never go back to the old OEM race system.

 

I have a Baker sealed bearing kit, I spoke to Mark at Baker and he told me that the bearings that they use have been holding up very well.
He also told me that some guys have removed one of the sides and that those are the only ones that they have had failures on...Food for thought I suppose.

If the sealed primary bearing holds up as long as a sealed wheel bearing does, that'll be way longer than it takes for the poorly thought out Harley bearing and race to screw up.

 

Okay. I received the Jims Sealed one piece bearing kit yesterday. It looks to be the all ***** kit with the label card removed, and the bearing is marked KLM which I'm pretty sure is Chinese made. Same exact bearing I just took out if the bike last weekend.
So, I picked up the Harley roller bearing and an S&S race. I installed the S&S race and just as I got close to the required 0.1 inch distance from the nut/seal, the race stopped right there. I think my tool would have broke if I tried to force it any further. I'm not sure what causes the race to stop but I'm sure that it isn't going to move until I really want it to. Someone else said the Baker one piece bearing is an NSK brand. Should be better and if I hear that is really dependable from various impartial sources, maybe I'll try that next time. I'm supposed to go on a run day after tomorrow so I had to get 'er done, but for me, I just want a trust-worthy friggin motorcycle that loves to run and has that sound and feel that we live for. Thanks to everyone on this forum for sharing your experiences so I can find my way through the myriad of parts out there and build my bike the way I want it. Awesome info here!