USAEUR was going apeshit last year because of the number of motorcycle fatalities they were having. We (military) seem to be heavy on Harley riders but I think it is the bullet bike crowd that is so busy wiping out. I haven't seen any kind of stat to support that though. I agree it gets old having the military with it's damn thumb on your life 24/7. My dad got out at 8 years, loved his job but the Army was driving him crazy. Don't think there is any need to point fingers about who pays our medical. I feel my insurance rates go up every time one of our non-dot wearing bretheren goes down in jeans and a t-shirt.

 

I just rode on base this weekend and had no issue with my DOT German helmet. I've always had to wear long sleeves, long pants, gloves, eye protection, & helemt whenever on an Army base. Now it may be different for the Air Force but this is the first I heard of a full face brain bucket being mandatory. Oh yeah, I almost forgot, the PT reflective strap is mandatory also.

 

I enjoy when military people act like they are free when complaining about things like this. Don't get me wrong, it is definately a bunch of crap but they DO own your ***. You should have read that contract you signed, I did. If some goof with shiny stuff decided he wants you to wear a tutu when you ride you will wear a tutu or you won't ride, period. When you get out you can think about personal freedoms but right now they are issued to you. I am not in any more butI work on a military base and these stupid things still step on my fun too. I don't wear a reflective vest becauseI found a loophole in the order but I get into an argument every timeI come through the gate. I find most laws like this rediculous, helmets, seatbelts etc. I use them because I like my body unsquished but I disagree with government forcing people to wear the stuff. If you want to bounce your grape off the street that's fine. You are an idiot but you should have the right to decide what you want to do about your PPE. For the military though, sorry, you signed away your rights to make just about any decision.

 

I think that it is wrong that the military or anyone can tell you what to wear on your own time. But as a employerI have specific rules about WORK related safety gear. When they leave our grounds they can do as they please. I used the healthcare analogy as an example to show who really ownsour ***. Yes, it's the government and thier infinite wisdom that makes these stupid decisionsas too which party can impose rules that are not bilateral. Everyone should be covered under the same rules and regulations that make up our laws. That being said , I am sure that the majority of taxpayers would not like to pay higher taxes or insurance premiums for those that do not want to conform. Is it compulsory in England to wear a full face ? . I don't know. I do know from talking to my travel insurance company that health care in England is very expensive . Perhaps this is the real reason for the full face requirement, after all you are not in the US ...Mark..

 

See, that's where you are getting mixed up. When you are in the military it is never "your time". You are a Soldier Sailor Airman or Marine 24 hours a day. You are out on a sunny saturday riding because the service LET you do so not because you are on your time. Military service goes so much deeper than any corperate affiliation. They own you, not metaphoricly, actually. We had a guy in my first unit fall asleep on the beach and get a terrible sunburn to where he could not function and had to go on bedrest. He was a shitbird and the command wanted to **** with him so they ran him up for "destruction of government property", meaning himself. I don't know what the outcome was, I PCSed before it went to the NJP. That illustrates it as best as can be done. As a servicemember you are for all intents and purposes, gear, equipment, an asset and often considered less important than a truck or comm equipment. Like that equipment though a dollar figure can be attached to you. Your training, your gear, your knowledge can all be quantified into a dollar amount and beleive you me the government is not about to let you screw up their investment because you choose to ride (how dare you, consider yourself lucky they let you at all) and then aggrevate that already risky situation with less than the maximum protective gear. I know it sucks but it is how it is. You are at their mercy until your time is up, maybe not even then, involuntary extension anyone?

 

Let me try to make this as clear as I can: When you're in the military, the only thing OWNED is your butt. There is not "own time." Clearly you've never been in the military, because the Canadian troopers in Vietnam, tough m*f*r's that they were, certainly "got it." Anything other than "yes sir" is whining, as in boo hoo. So please, stop with the rational arguments.

 

Uncle Sam owns you as long as you are a military member. They can article 15 you for a sunburn if they choose to!

Our military is wonderful. I did my time...but you lose rights when you serve.

 

Look... I don't want to sound "Pissy" about this... BUT...

If you have a problem with the rules... "K-Mart" is hiring!!! They don't care what you wear on the way to work!!! Unless you're working in the chow-hall, the Government has a few bucks tied up in you!!!

YES!!! I'm sure it IS a PITA!!! But I turned down the Officer crap, did my four... and now "Common Sense" tells me to wear safety equipment!!!

Sorry... but when you get off MY Dollar, You can wear what you want!!!

Thanks for the Service, by the way, I'm glad you've survived two Combat Tours... NOW... Don't SCREW UP YOUR LUCK!!!

Jim aka kiltiemon

 

One of the things I used to always tell my troops is that you give up a lot of your "rights" when you join the military. That's just part of the deal, like it or not. Yep, sometimes it sucks. I'm a GS employee now, and I ride to work every chance I get. I always ride with jeans, boots and gloves, but today it was in the 80s here and I would have loved to not have to wear long sleeves. Fortunately, the gate guards here don't hassle with you that much about reflective gear or "contrasting colors" I just throw an old button up long sleeve shirt on over whatever I'm wearing to work and go.

Although...one of the MSF instructors here on base is a Lt. and his boss is always getting harassed about his reflective gear and everything else when riding on base, so when the Lt. asked one of the gate guards why they always gave his boss so much grief, the Airman responded with a big smile "Cause he's a Colonel!"

 

Sorry mark that was a little rude. Guys lets not get this one twisted though this isn't a "yes sir three bags full situation" there is a clear DOD directive(DOT helmet, gloves, over the ankle boots, long sleeves and pants, bright garmet day reflective gear at night) and then their are post to post directives than can vary depending on whether or not the Post Commander is a rider or a hater. It can be changed but the riders have to make some noise anything that is not good order or discipline thing can be looked at. This one should be taken to AF safety center. I know Ft Riley guys got KS abate involved there and I think there rules have been relaxed back to DOT approved from full face. Granted it may come back to a just deal with it but you never know until you try. Myself being the argumentative type would be in the safety office wanting to know the facts and figures presented to the old man as to why this change was made. Therein lies the rub with most of these it's one guy presenting his side of the story to the commander and the old man makes a decision based on that. Find out those numbers and if you have a Post meeting there like we do here bring it up to the old man then with numbers and riders to bike your side. Basically what I am saying his don't take it without a fight if you don't think it's right.

Edit: You didn't say what your rank was so fair warning if you lower enlisted/Jr officer class 2 download all above you don;t want to deal with the hassle that would cause.