Do you downshift or use your brakes?
#101
11-01-2006, 04:40 AM
RE: Do you downshift or use your brakes?
Who says that downshifting or engine braking is bad? They are getting their information from the internet? Man I'd rather listen to my friends advice or a dealership mechanics advice. Definitely not a quote from the net. Downshifting is tthe best part about riding.
#102
11-01-2006, 05:00 AM
RE: Do you downshift or use your brakes?
Exactly dynaloride. I don't think it beats accelerating in the fun category, but it sure is fun hearing those pipes sing! And besides, the bikes are built for it.
ORIGINAL: dynalowride
Who says that downshifting or engine braking is bad? They are getting their information from the internet? Man I'd rather listen to my friends advice or a dealership mechanics advice. Definitely not a quote from the net. Downshifting is tthe best part about riding.
Who says that downshifting or engine braking is bad? They are getting their information from the internet? Man I'd rather listen to my friends advice or a dealership mechanics advice. Definitely not a quote from the net. Downshifting is tthe best part about riding.
#103
11-01-2006, 10:41 AM
RE: Do you downshift or use your brakes?
downshiftinmg is the way to go, just don't lock uyp da rear tire 
plus when you get stopped your in 1st and ready to go if a shark bears down on you
plus when you get stopped your in 1st and ready to go if a shark bears down on you
#104
11-01-2006, 10:48 AM
RE: Do you downshift or use your brakes?
You don't need to downshift to be in first gear when you come to a stop. The only difference is whether you let out the clutch or not when you downshift to each gear.
#105
11-01-2006, 01:15 PM
RE: Do you downshift or use your brakes?
unless im in heavy traffic i almost always down shift 3 or so gears before applying brake. i have raced motorcycles and beat the sh*t out of transmissions, never broke one. i do clutcless downshifts and upshifts(sometimes). i've yet to break anything. I once owned a 1973 suzuki TS250. i resurected the top end and put in a quart of oil. i had no brakes, no clutch handle/cable, i shifted it up and down for 2 years before i destoyed the frame in a crash. the engine is still good and tranny works great. i'd say downshifting before braking is a perfectly acceptable practice as long as you know what your doing. YMMV
#106
11-01-2006, 08:21 PM
RE: Do you downshift or use your brakes?
Exactly! It doesn't hurt a thing and it is the proper way to ride!
ORIGINAL: itsmyforte
unless im in heavy traffic i almost always down shift 3 or so gears before applying brake. i have raced motorcycles and beat the sh*t out of transmissions, never broke one. i do clutcless downshifts and upshifts(sometimes). i've yet to break anything. I once owned a 1973 suzuki TS250. i resurected the top end and put in a quart of oil. i had no brakes, no clutch handle/cable, i shifted it up and down for 2 years before i destoyed the frame in a crash. the engine is still good and tranny works great. i'd say downshifting before braking is a perfectly acceptable practice as long as you know what your doing. YMMV
unless im in heavy traffic i almost always down shift 3 or so gears before applying brake. i have raced motorcycles and beat the sh*t out of transmissions, never broke one. i do clutcless downshifts and upshifts(sometimes). i've yet to break anything. I once owned a 1973 suzuki TS250. i resurected the top end and put in a quart of oil. i had no brakes, no clutch handle/cable, i shifted it up and down for 2 years before i destoyed the frame in a crash. the engine is still good and tranny works great. i'd say downshifting before braking is a perfectly acceptable practice as long as you know what your doing. YMMV
#107
11-01-2006, 08:54 PM
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RE: Do you downshift or use your brakes?
yep, downshifting is the way, bike and car.
i dont care about saving brake pads, and it doesnt hurt or wear the tranny or clutch either.
its all about riding properly.
i dont care about saving brake pads, and it doesnt hurt or wear the tranny or clutch either.
its all about riding properly.
#108
11-01-2006, 08:56 PM
RE: Do you downshift or use your brakes?
Now there's a man who "gets" it!
ORIGINAL: dogtownmax
yep, downshifting is the way, bike and car.
i dont care about saving brake pads, and it doesnt hurt or wear the tranny or clutch either.
its all about riding properly.
yep, downshifting is the way, bike and car.
i dont care about saving brake pads, and it doesnt hurt or wear the tranny or clutch either.
its all about riding properly.
#109
11-02-2006, 02:56 AM
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RE: Do you downshift or use your brakes?
I disagree that downshifting/engine braking is the "proper" way to ride. The proper way to ride is to control the bike to a stop. Brakes and/or Downshifting both do that. My personal opinions and rationale for just using the brakes:
1) Using the brakes keeps the brake lights on until I'm stopped.
2) I've been riding for 20 years, I KNOW how to downshift. I think the ride is smoother with just brakes.
3) I don't care what anybody says, if you have a motor that's putting energy out the drivetrain in one direction, then you suddenly reverse it by engine braking, there is going to be more wear and tear on that drivetrain than if you just disengage the clutch and use the brakes. I can change brake pads in half an hour. Crank bearings, tranny gears, clutches...all more expensive than brake pads.
For what it's worth, I decided to read up on this and there's as much disagreement among the 'experts' as there is in this thread. For example, this 10 year MSF instructor contradicts even himself and gives valid points on both sides of the issue:
http://experts.about.com/q/Motorcycl...shifting-1.htm
One recommendation by the 'expert'
Another recommendation by the same 'expert'
The expert's credentials: Author of several books on riding, 10 years as an MSF Instructor, and Public Information Officer for Minnesota's Motorcycle Saftey Center.
1) Using the brakes keeps the brake lights on until I'm stopped.
2) I've been riding for 20 years, I KNOW how to downshift. I think the ride is smoother with just brakes.
3) I don't care what anybody says, if you have a motor that's putting energy out the drivetrain in one direction, then you suddenly reverse it by engine braking, there is going to be more wear and tear on that drivetrain than if you just disengage the clutch and use the brakes. I can change brake pads in half an hour. Crank bearings, tranny gears, clutches...all more expensive than brake pads.
For what it's worth, I decided to read up on this and there's as much disagreement among the 'experts' as there is in this thread. For example, this 10 year MSF instructor contradicts even himself and gives valid points on both sides of the issue:
http://experts.about.com/q/Motorcycl...shifting-1.htm
One recommendation by the 'expert'
By keeping the clutch squeezed as you come to a stop, this allows the brakes to do most of the work of stopping. In real life, this is good, because the brake light will alert others to your intentions better than engine braking. There are lots of people out there who think braking with the clutch (engine braking) is cool, but the reality is, unless you’re a factory-sponsored racer, brake pads are simpler to replace than clutch pads. Use engine braking for special occasions, not for everyday work."
For what it's worth, I always use the engine braking technique except in rare instances. I find that the engine shifts easier that way. Sometimes if you let the wait too long between rolling off/squeezing and downshifting, it can be kind of clunky or resistant to the change in gear. Also, I prefer to always have the clutch engaged and in gear, even when slowing, in case for some reason I need to accelerate...having to ease out the clutch is just another step that costs a slight amount of time.
The expert's credentials: Author of several books on riding, 10 years as an MSF Instructor, and Public Information Officer for Minnesota's Motorcycle Saftey Center.
http://allexperts.com/expert.cgi?m=1...90&expID=26083
Experience in the area
I'm an MSF-Certified Instructor (10 years), author of the motorcycle safety books How to Ride a Motorcycle, Ride Hard, Ride Smart, co-author of Motorcycle Track Day Handbook, and Public Information Officer for the State of Minnesota: I coordinate public information and education for the Minnesota Motorcycle Safety Center, a project of the Minnesota Department of Public Safety.
Experience in the area
I'm an MSF-Certified Instructor (10 years), author of the motorcycle safety books How to Ride a Motorcycle, Ride Hard, Ride Smart, co-author of Motorcycle Track Day Handbook, and Public Information Officer for the State of Minnesota: I coordinate public information and education for the Minnesota Motorcycle Safety Center, a project of the Minnesota Department of Public Safety.
#110
11-02-2006, 07:00 AM
RE: Do you downshift or use your brakes?
Good post-but I still disagree.
1-Notice the expert says that he ALWAYS uses engine braking.
2-I downshift and use brakes at the same time thus warning those behind me.
3-I never "suddenly" reverse direction on the drivetrain. I put no more pressure than if I let go of the throttle and the engine "held back" during deceleration. I give a little turn on the throttle to bring up the rpms and there is no excess strain.
4-the expert, when he mentioned that pad are cheaper etc. says "in real life it is better to use brakes". He is saying this because he knows that there are alot of people who don't know how to downshift properly and they ride the clutch or chirp the tires, lock up the wheel etc. He writes that for the idiots but tells you that he "always" uses the engine braking technique.
5-A good engine braking technique is, indeed, the proper, and more advanced, way to ride. Any expert will tell you that.(and any service tech).
1-Notice the expert says that he ALWAYS uses engine braking.
2-I downshift and use brakes at the same time thus warning those behind me.
3-I never "suddenly" reverse direction on the drivetrain. I put no more pressure than if I let go of the throttle and the engine "held back" during deceleration. I give a little turn on the throttle to bring up the rpms and there is no excess strain.
4-the expert, when he mentioned that pad are cheaper etc. says "in real life it is better to use brakes". He is saying this because he knows that there are alot of people who don't know how to downshift properly and they ride the clutch or chirp the tires, lock up the wheel etc. He writes that for the idiots but tells you that he "always" uses the engine braking technique.
5-A good engine braking technique is, indeed, the proper, and more advanced, way to ride. Any expert will tell you that.(and any service tech).
ORIGINAL: jmxp
I disagree that downshifting/engine braking is the "proper" way to ride. The proper way to ride is to control the bike to a stop. Brakes and/or Downshifting both do that. My personal opinions and rationale for just using the brakes:
1) Using the brakes keeps the brake lights on until I'm stopped.
2) I've been riding for 20 years, I KNOW how to downshift. I think the ride is smoother with just brakes.
3) I don't care what anybody says, if you have a motor that's putting energy out the drivetrain in one direction, then you suddenly reverse it by engine braking, there is going to be more wear and tear on that drivetrain than if you just disengage the clutch and use the brakes. I can change brake pads in half an hour. Crank bearings, tranny gears, clutches...all more expensive than brake pads.
For what it's worth, I decided to read up on this and there's as much disagreement among the 'experts' as there is in this thread. For example, this 10 year MSF instructor contradicts even himself and gives valid points on both sides of the issue:
http://experts.about.com/q/Motorcycl...shifting-1.htm
One recommendation by the 'expert'
Another recommendation by the same 'expert'
The expert's credentials: Author of several books on riding, 10 years as an MSF Instructor, and Public Information Officer for Minnesota's Motorcycle Saftey Center.
I disagree that downshifting/engine braking is the "proper" way to ride. The proper way to ride is to control the bike to a stop. Brakes and/or Downshifting both do that. My personal opinions and rationale for just using the brakes:
1) Using the brakes keeps the brake lights on until I'm stopped.
2) I've been riding for 20 years, I KNOW how to downshift. I think the ride is smoother with just brakes.
3) I don't care what anybody says, if you have a motor that's putting energy out the drivetrain in one direction, then you suddenly reverse it by engine braking, there is going to be more wear and tear on that drivetrain than if you just disengage the clutch and use the brakes. I can change brake pads in half an hour. Crank bearings, tranny gears, clutches...all more expensive than brake pads.
For what it's worth, I decided to read up on this and there's as much disagreement among the 'experts' as there is in this thread. For example, this 10 year MSF instructor contradicts even himself and gives valid points on both sides of the issue:
http://experts.about.com/q/Motorcycl...shifting-1.htm
One recommendation by the 'expert'
By keeping the clutch squeezed as you come to a stop, this allows the brakes to do most of the work of stopping. In real life, this is good, because the brake light will alert others to your intentions better than engine braking. There are lots of people out there who think braking with the clutch (engine braking) is cool, but the reality is, unless you’re a factory-sponsored racer, brake pads are simpler to replace than clutch pads. Use engine braking for special occasions, not for everyday work."
For what it's worth, I always use the engine braking technique except in rare instances. I find that the engine shifts easier that way. Sometimes if you let the wait too long between rolling off/squeezing and downshifting, it can be kind of clunky or resistant to the change in gear. Also, I prefer to always have the clutch engaged and in gear, even when slowing, in case for some reason I need to accelerate...having to ease out the clutch is just another step that costs a slight amount of time.
The expert's credentials: Author of several books on riding, 10 years as an MSF Instructor, and Public Information Officer for Minnesota's Motorcycle Saftey Center.
http://allexperts.com/expert.cgi?m=1...90&expID=26083
Experience in the area
I'm an MSF-Certified Instructor (10 years), author of the motorcycle safety books How to Ride a Motorcycle, Ride Hard, Ride Smart, co-author of Motorcycle Track Day Handbook, and Public Information Officer for the State of Minnesota: I coordinate public information and education for the Minnesota Motorcycle Safety Center, a project of the Minnesota Department of Public Safety.
Experience in the area
I'm an MSF-Certified Instructor (10 years), author of the motorcycle safety books How to Ride a Motorcycle, Ride Hard, Ride Smart, co-author of Motorcycle Track Day Handbook, and Public Information Officer for the State of Minnesota: I coordinate public information and education for the Minnesota Motorcycle Safety Center, a project of the Minnesota Department of Public Safety.