Dont know if this has been said cause i didnt go through all 11 pages but its expensive the same reason a motorcycle tire is twice as expensive as a car tire that is much larger: There are less parts on a motorcycle so they charge you more for them. Simple as that. Why do you pay $300 for 2 pistons when you can buy a set of eight of the same quality for a car engine for $500??? Or buy a cam for your V-8 for $150 but pay $300-700 for cams for a Harley??

 

Didn't know it was a contest. Yes... Finishmaster is a jobber, so they are not likely to give you much of a deal. By adding the middle man, you have more people involved who need to make a profit. Aside from that, around here at least, Finishmaster won't sell to people off the street - you have to have a shop and set up an account with them.

Being in California, you are restricted in what you can buy from any paint supplier. Most of the less expensive paint lines don't meet the VOC regulations you have there. In National Rule states (which for now, is pretty much every state other than CA), you have many more options on paint lines.

SW's Dimension paint line is very affordable. Some of the colors can get a little pricey, but nowhere near the Ultra 7000 or AWX (waterborne) lines. One of the big secrets in their lineup is AIC (advanced Industrial Coatings) which is pretty much relabeled Dimension. For basic, non-metallic colors, if you can go with a single stage, you can buy a *Gallon* of AIC for very little money (compared to other paint lines).

Although SW does sell through some jobbers, all of the SW Automotive stores are company owned. They are more likely to work with you on pricing, and they generally carry all the SW Automotive paint lines (whereas jobbers tend to carry as little as possible as inventory costs would otherwise kill them - and they typically carry more than on brand of paint, so carrying all lines of anyone brand is even more prohibitive).

I left that gig recently to take a position with a biker magazine. However, I do still have quite a few contacts at SW and could point you in the right direction. Just as jobbers differ from location to location, SW locations vary depending on the manager at that particular store. Some are better than others, offer better service, are more likely to work with you on price.

One key to getting good paint pricing is to have them set you up as a body shop so you're not paying retail. With most of the SW stores I know, you can set up a cash account as a small body shop (Joe Blow's Autobody) simply by telling them you are a new shop just getting started. This gives you the shop rate on everything.

 

Sort of. It's all about production. Anything manufactured has initial costs involved - the R&D in developing the part, tooling or other set up costs for the manufacturing equipment, etc. Those initial costs are part of the sale price of the part. The more parts sold, the less those initial costs impact the price.

As an example, let's say
- the initial costs for a particular new Harley part are $50,000.
- The cost the manufacture the part is $100 (materials & labor)
- required margin is $40

In this example, if they only expected to ever sell on part, the selling price of the part would be $50,140.

If they were to make 50,000 parts, the cost would be $141.

One of the biggest reasons MC parts are expensive is very few are sold (because there are fewer MC's and cars, because that part only fits one or a few models, etc.)

A company might expect to sell hundreds or maybe thousands of motorcycle tires, while they will sell millions of car tires.

 

For obvious reasons, what an ideal job for you, assuming that you'll be writing of course. What magazine, so that we can follow along with your ramblings?

And thanks for the offer on a paint hookup but I dont buy often enough to worry about it.

 

I do pretty much anything and everything, although the focus is on ad sales. I only write when I have to. Yes... I usually write whatever it is I am writing, check the word count, then go back to delete a bunch of stuff to hit the target number.

For what I assume may be obvious reasons, I prefer to keep my Midnitevil identity separate from what I do with the magazine. As you may have noticed, I have some pretty strong opinions on some topics, which are sometimes not well received by some number of people. I like to use the internet as a method of spreading these ideas - maybe change how some people view some things, or at least make them think about it a little.

That is in opposition from working for a magazine (or other media) where one needs be a bit more mindful of what they say and how they say it. Neutrality is also important.

I have mentioned some things about it in various places online, and I suppose if someone were willing to make the effort, they could find a connection between my Midnitevil identity (the real me - saying it like I think it) and my magazine identity (which doesn't exist in this particular forum).

The magazine is focused on the Midwestern states, so I don't believe you'd find it relevant or as interesting in CA - and there is nowhere you could pick it up there, but... if you are truly interested I'd PM you the web site and you could subscribe to it.

... but really, if you want to follow my ramblings, HD forums is your best bet. As you well know, I let it all out here.

Well, if you ever need anything, let me know & I'll give you a contact near you.

 

I agree with what your saying but at the same time it would kind of offset itself somewhat with the lower cost to manufacture a tire because it uses less raw material. Same goes for a camshaft in a V-8. It takes probly 4 times the material to produce as well as bigger(more expensive) machines to manufacture that camshaft as opposed to a H-D set of cams. Now with the initial costs i can understand the higher price of the part but i do think it goes overboard. Its like a toll road thats paid off but you still get charged to drive it(no one ever lowers the cost of anything)Think about how many Twin Cams are on the road from 1999-2010. Thats 11years but it still costs $700 for a couple S+S cams?? You cant possibly tell me that after 10 years of making cams that they havent covered theyre initial tooling costs, R&D, etc? One other point is that people are willing to pay the higher price so they charge the higher price... Simple supply and demand

Btw this argument does not apply to the OP about the expense of painting. That is simply what the going rate is because one person raised the rates and ppl paid it so everybody followed suit. I can remember not to many years ago you could get a good paint job from a professional painter for $2-300 and a full on custom job for $7-800 that today will cost you $2k...

 

Interesting postings here...I need to catch up.

 

Certainly supply and demand factors into the price. Still, even as many TC 88's as there may be on the road, it's still a very small number compared to cars. Then factor how many people might buy S&S cams for those TC 88's, and you're talking a pretty minuscule market there.

Total motorcycle registration in the US as of 2006 were 6.6 million. Total auto registrations were over 134 million. With such a small potential market, prices on motorcycle parts will always be higher.


I agree with you there. The rate to paint bike tins is the same as the rate for painting a car, truck or anything else. The bike cost less to paint because there are fewer labor hours (and, to a very small degree, less materials cost)

In this paragraph, you imply rates are raised arbitrarily. In reality, rates are set at where needed to cover all expenses and allow for some profit. Even then, the autobody industry is highly regulated, as well as the insurance companies very much dictating what a shop will be paid. As I've stated elsewhere, most body shops are not raking in a ton of profit.

Speaking of insurance companies, that brings up another point. The labor rate varies by location, but, let's use $42 per hour for body work (which includes painting). None of the insurance companies pay this rate. Some of them pay as little as $26 per labor hour. the effect then is the body shop is making little or NO profit on insurance work. That means they will work to get everything they can on the non-insurance work to make up for it.

As with many things in life - you can blame the insurance companies for causing higher prices.

 

Very good points. As far as the paint prices go though i still would have to disagree that for a basic one color paint job including prep work and clear coat, that the cost of supplies and labor would equal $1k. Granted i am not in the painting business but i do remember a time when i painted a bike in my garage and the cost of supplys were under a $100. 1 Quart of paint was around $40, so the rest was wet/dry sandpaper, etc... I will say that the biggest thing you pay for is the painter not the supplies. Prep work will pretty much determine the life and quality of the paint job. So in that aspect i would pay a higher price rather than go with a cheapie paint job.

 

Cost of supplies is nearly insignificat. Average is about 7% of the cost of the paint job. It's pretty much *all* labor.

Exactly. The thing is, you can do an outstanding paint job yourself and save a ton of money, *if* you're willing to put the time into it. Not to take anything away from professional painters, but, the truth is, shooting paint is not a difficult skill. What a painter really brings to the table is experience and knowledge. There is a lot to know about mixing the paint the right way, and what to mix it with in the first place - based on the conditions present when you are going to shoot the paint. Humidity and temperature can very throughout the day. He may mix the same paint one way in the early morning, a different way mid day, and still a different way that afternoon. Granted, it mostly effects drying time, but also plays a role in the finished product.

A professional painter also know what to do if he runs into a problem. I can't tell you how many DIY'ers I've dealt with who had a problem with their primer, went ahead and shot the basecoat and clear, THEN they come to me and ask me how to fix it (starting with something like "I really botched the primer and now my paint job looks like ****. How do I fix that and will you give me more product for free since it was your stuff that screwed it up?")

Doing the paint job yourself also has a lot to do with who you buy it from. I've worked with people who have never painted in their life, sold them everything they needed, and basically trained them on how to use it.

One guy came in with a *beautiful* '72 Camaro previously painted with House of Kolor products. He was unhappy with it - primarily because he drove the car a lot (HOK is great for show cars, not so great for anything you actually drive as it is not nearly as chip or UV resistant as other products). The dude had about $80 grand into this car (everything was custom, down to the $700 one-off custom made stainless steel hood hinges). He had sideswiped another car and needed to replace a door & fender, so he decided he wanted to paint the whole car himself. I walked him through the prep (he took it down to bare metal) and every step to completion, selling him what he needed as we went along. The funny thing is, when it was all done, he had done an awesome custom paint job on the car, but when it came to buffing it out, he got scared he'd burn through the clear. He took it to a custom paint shop to get it sanded & buffed and the owner asked him who painted it - said it was one of the best paint jobs he had ever seen.

I'm rambling again, aren't I?