I've read a lot of comment on the forum about "never skid the rear wheel and, in case, keeping it skiddin, or you are going to get a highsider".
This because, supposedly, the bike would slide, then regain traction, jolt and hurl the rider away while it straightens up.
Now, I have very limited experience in bike riding, but this statement (and the explanation why it happens) clashes badly with my own experience in car drifting and with Supermotard riding experience on part of some friends, who skid they rear wheel in spectacular drifts and never get a highside, or even stunt riding of HD bikes seen in movies or on TV.
So, I'd like to express what I think and then hear some expert's opinion, so to better understand and see if I got it right or I'm only partially correct, or completely off.
I'll make a comparison with a car because that's what I know best.

The point, I believe, is that many consider traction like something you get or not, much like an on/off switch.
If you badly drift a car, especially one without a limited slip differential, and you are clumsy in countersteering and, above all, gas management, what you get is a drift and then, when you countersteer to controll the drift, a "whiplash" the other side. The rear wheels abruptly regain traction, the car is pushed sharply the other way and, if you are not fast in counter-countersteering, you end up in a 360 the other way. The car, obviously, has 4 wheels. On a bike you'd get a highsider, exactly as explained.
But on cars with a limited slip diff, traction is regained gradually, and if you control the drift correctly, and you use the gas correctly, the drift gently stops, grip is regained gradually and, the more grip you regain, the more the car (or bike) stabilises itself.
In a bike, which obviously has no differential, the point is all in throttle control. Roll of throttle abruptly (or release brake abruptly) and you get an abrupt reaction.
Control throttle (or brake) smoothly, and you get a smooth reaction.
I can only guess that on a bike as heavy as a Harley, with the monster torque of a Harley engine, it's not as easy as with a light supermotard bike with it's little engine.
But stunts do drifts on HD bikes. It can be done.
Moreover, bikes don't loose traction "instantly". They react faster than a car, but with adequate sensibility towards the vehicle behaviour, you distinctly feel when the rear wheel is about to give up, and it is possible to feel the wheel when it's about to let go. I can get it, with my meagre experience, so it can't be so difficult.
I believe (but that's my personal opinion) that instead of adopting a tecnic like "don't release the brake", one should focus on better comprehension of the bike behaviour, recognizing the signs that foretell the reaching of its physical limits, and correct brake or throttle management, when you go said limits, intentionally or by accident.
By "don't letting go of the brake/gas" you probably avoid a highsider, but you forfait control of the vehicle. And, after all, you could end up in a high sider all the same, after all, as if a bike sliding sideways hits the least impefection on the road, it will flip over all the same.
Again, these are my own considerations, of a very unskilled rider.
Now I'd like to know from an expert how things go.
Thanks in advance.

 

Consider the friction circle. When the rear wheel is locked, 100% of it's available traction is being used along the direction the wheel is pointed, and 0% is available laterally.

(This is why, for instance, you can use the emergency brake in a car to induce oversteer by locking the rear wheels).

Now, if the rider is looking ahead and up properly, chances are that the rear wheel will track fairly closely with the direction of travel, and the bike will come to a stop upright and in control.

If, however, the rear wheel is not tracking in the same general direction the bike is traveling (think rear-wheel drift in a car), a skilled rider can continue this drift with counter-steering (like you see the pros do on the track).

But....

If the rear wheel is in a drift, and the brake is released, lateral traction suddenly becomes available. The bike will try to stand up as the rear wheel's lateral travel is brought back into line by the sudden return of lateral grip. This standing up can be quite quick and forceful, and may well launch the rider off the bike. Welcome to a high-side. The flight might not be bad, but the landing is going to suck.

And you are, of course, completely correct that the best way to prevent all of the above is to ride within one's limits with an adequate safety factor, and avoid the situation altogether.

Matt

 

go watch super bike races and you see them highside when coming out of a turn.

 

What I meant is that, yes, if you abruptly and completely release the brake, you get an abrut and complete return of grip. Highsider. SPLAT. Pain (If you are lucky).
The trick is to regain traction progressively and smoothly, not abruptly and all at once. It's the same in car drifting. If you regain grip abruptly and all at once, you may not get a highsider, you may not be launched away, but when you hit the guard rail or wall, it sucks all the same, believe me!
Smooth is the key.
At least for what I understand, which may be faulty in some little (but essential) detail.
And, even if I'm correct, how one trains to be smooth, safely?
Funny little beasts, bikes: they are the most dangerous vehicle on land, but the only way you got to learn ride them, is by trial and error.

 

It's much safer and easier to not skid the rear wheel in the first place.
Remember this is taught as what to do if you over brake and skid the rear wheel. (Usually a panic situation).

 

Well, yes, obviously.

 

Agree with the panic position. I have also momentarily skidded the rear tire due to water/oil on the road. breaking hard, hit slick spot and skid, go sideways a little, then hit dry spot again and get traction - it sucks. I have never high sided from it but in a panic situation this was luck and not my great skills...


I beleive that simple and repeatable is the reason for the training that once locked keep it locked when talking about rear tire skids. If you are trained and practice "smoothly " recovering I am sure it can be done. I would say less than 10% of the riding population would achieve this level of profiencecy during panic situatiions though.

 

Tracion is the operative word here. You do not need to use the brake to lose rear wheel traction. If you are drifting (power sliding) the rear wheel and back off the throttle you may find yourself highsiding if you are too slow to get back on the throttle. I had this happen to me years ago. I had the back end hung out too far and was about to lay it down. I backed off the throttle, the bike started to come back up and I was too late to get back on the throttle. I high sided and watched a 500 bike flip over the top of me.

 

Not adding or subtracting from the observations about what it might take work a proper skid/drift on a bike...
I think that it is entirely possible and is demonstrated endless times by highly skilled and well experienced riders in reasonably controlled conditions (ie:a track).

I think the real issue is the "when" not the "how" of a high side type scene.
The average rider has limited training at best, does not spend day after day in the saddle, and does not practice evasive or emergency maneuvers. Add to this the complete randomness of road accidents and you end up with a total panic situation, wherein the rider is ill equipped to respond.
The rider locks it up, slides, unlocks it and flies...before they really even had a chance to realize what was happening.
Similar I believe to the riders who fail to negotiate a curve due to target panic.

Riding away from a sideways rear wheel drift is indeed possible, but I think ridiculously improbable, for the average rider.

 

As long as the bike is straight, releasing the brake to let the rear tire gain traction again is simple. If the rear tire starts to come around any thought of releasing the rear brake is a disaster waiting to happen. Not saying it is impossible but it is improbable you will ever maintain control with the violent maneuvering that will happen. But as my Grandpa said ---try it and let me know how it worked out.