Open loop and closed loop has nothing to do with throttle opening. Has to do with oxygen sensor and temp sensors being warm enough to function in their design range, putting the system into ' closed loop', that is, where the oxygen and other related sensors are giving feedback to the ECU, allowing it to control the mixture, which isn't the case during cold startup or 'open loop' operation.

 

Honestly....don't do it. Until VERY recently I was sold on the Xieds. I was running stock mufflers, with the baffles removed, and no Xides. Then I added the Xides, and BANG ! Instant seat of the pants improvement. Throttle roll on was greatly improved, and I could actually use 6th gear. I was convinced. Then...I came across a set of V&H slip ons and added those. Immediate let down. I also at that time added the stage I a/f after confirming with Nightrider that the Xides would be more than sufficient with these mods. I rode for near 200 miles and it just ran WEAK ! I removed the stage I and the performance improved a little, but this bike still lacks seriously in the performance area. I'm right now looking at a PC III but with recent surge of failures, I'm more than a little dubious. I am also considering a screamin' eagle race fueler, and a cobra fi2000. Not sure what I want to do. I really want a SERT and a Dyno tune, but I work for a living and just don't have the beans to penny up for that, plus, the indy mechanic who does my services just had his '08 STREET GLIDE custom mapped with a SERT says it just wasn't worth the money, so he put a fuel pack on his wife's new nightster and they both love it.....go figure.

 

unless your 06 was a dyna glide, you didnt have closed loop efi.

 

please explain a bit more. cold start up OR open loop operation?
when does the bike actually go into open loop? and does that mean open loop in lean? or rich on the scale. assuming median closed loop as the benchmark.

 

Please elaborate if you would. I have not heard anything about it and I am considering one.

 

You can get away with the slipons as they don't really effect the overall performance of the egine cept perhaps a bit less backpressure which will probably drop your overall horsepower and low end accelleration. They ( in most cases from what I've experienced )should not have much affect on the running temperture. Dealers will tell you otherwise and insist on the remap and indeed it may boost performance a bit but its not necesary. Your oxygen senors are there for a reason and they will ajust the airfuel mix by command of the bikes computer to compensate for most exhaust differences due to the type of muffler used. I am refering to slipons only and not entire exhaust change overs such as true duals or mufflers without baffles. But make no mistake about it, that if you change the air flow that is going into the engine and by that I mean increase it with a high flow (stage1) air filter your oxygen sensors cannot deal with this large an increase and your engine temp will dramatically increase. Remapping your computer to allow for this is now required or serious damage can be done to your engine. I myself run Rolling Thunder slipons on my FLHTC with no download and my oil temp runs between 190-220 depending on outside conditions. Pretty much normal. That is with the factory air filter. I know I could get better performance out of the bike with the a stage 1 filter and the remap but I was never into the fast speed stuff. If you do just the slipon deal alway's make sure to check the plugs to see if their burning properly. I have a digital oil temp dipstick and if one is available for your bike I would strongly recommend one. They give you a easy way to keep in check with your engine (oil) tempeture. Good Luck

 

The oxygen sensors do have to warm up, you are correct about that. Once they are warmed up you are in closed loop only where the fuel table has a value for 14.6 afr. That value acts as a switch with the closed loop bias table controlling the actual afr. A value of 480 mV in the closed loop bias table is 14.6 afr.

The fuel table is by map pressure and rpm. Map pressure, pretty well, tracks throttle position through it is also dependant upon rpms and atmospheric pressure. At wot you're running 95+ kPa map pressure. With the stage 1 download for a non-cvo dyna the requested afr is 12.5 at 95+ kPa above 1500 rpms. You are running open loop at that point.

The O2 Sensors are narrowband. That means they only accurately measure afr over a narrow band of afr's. Specifically they can accurately measure from about 14.2 to 15.0 afr. The XIED's let you pretend to run closed loop outside that range. That's pretend because the O2 Sensors output is, pretty much, meaningless at 13.8 afr. It is more a measure of the temperature of the exhaust than it is the afr of the charge.

 

PCIII + advanced map is the key

I rode around on my bike with just the straight shots + SE Air and didn't feel hardly any increase in power (already had my PCIII, I was just testing it out). It ran perfectly fine, but we all know it's too lean. Once I did the PCIII and went for a test drive my jaw was pretty much on the pavement, I couldn't believe how much of a difference it made. Ideally, I should also get a dyno tune down the road, but the advanced map got me close enough for now. Also, the PCIII lets you increase your redline without having to get the ECM flash.

Whether or not to get a remap/tune is not a question, you MUST do it if you change both the air and pipes. Go read about what a lean condition will do to an engine after a few thousand miles. Yes, the O2 sensors will adjust the ratio at very small levels, but it is mainly used to even out the difference between elevations above sea level. Changing out air + pipes exceeds the O2's capability.

 

#1 Actually it was about $160 for my dealer to do the remap. HD of South Charleston, WV doesn't stick it to us customers as bad as some...

#2 Wrong....like I said from the dealer....

#3 Usually you can't really tell the difference. The main noticeable difference for me was a little less decel popping after the remap.

#4 HAHA...we're prolly all getting scammed to SOME degree. 20% is what my hd mechanic told me. The guy is real straight up, and has actually saved me from spending money I don't need to. Even though the ECU MAY adjust 20% i think the map still may fool it to run richer like someone else said.

#5 Well I still don't mind to spend $160 to be on the safe side and POSSIBLY protect my investment. Plus my mechanic told me that if I were to do my mods and something went wrong down the road they wouldn't be able to repair it under warranty. With their map they would repair it under warranty cause they will stand behind their work....also worth the $160...

#6 V&H sideshots, dealer map and K&N filter....just the pipes are SUPPOSED to bring 10 hp (I know, relying on spec sheet). And I tell you I got every bit of that. I REALLY noticed it in the low end torque too, roll-ons were %100 more responsive and I can shift about 5mph slower (if I want) without lugging. OH YEAH...I'm very meticulaous (read: **** retentive) about calculating mpg....and I actually got slightly better mileage afterwards.

#7 Why? Cause you can never have enough power. Sound wasn't what I wanted, and yes my mods met and greatly exceeded my expectations.....

 

danmo, you don't have the exhaust sensors on your bike. They are what control the AFR, regardless of what ever else you do unless you replace the ECM, or modify the output of the exhaust sensors. The sensors make sure that the EPA gets 14.6:1 AFR