This is just a comment and not a direct responce to the original question.

If it was up to me and I could do one thing to help people who are interested in learning how to ride a full size, heavy weight street bike....it would be getting them on a 250cc or so dual purpose (only so I could famelierize them with the turn signals and lighting....otherwise it would be a plain jane dirt bike) machine, and have them start out on dirt trails, and in fields on some sort of marked course. This way they can get the basic feel for the geomitry, and rules of physics as applied to riding a motorcycle. I would bet that within day I could teach them more about "riding the bike" (not any rules of the road or speed limit, making leagel turns stuff) than they could ever learn on full sized street bike on pavment.

I could be dead wrong.....but I would like to give it a try one day.

 

In the 30 years I have been riding, Ihad never heard of counter steering, until I read about it on the forums. As statedin previous posts , counter steering is done instinctively. If it wasn't, the first curve you came up on, your bike would go straight ahead.
The major importance of realizing how to counter steer, IMHO, is in an emergency avoidance maneuver. In that type situation, some rider's will panic and try and steer the bike in the direction they want it to go, to avoid the obstacle. That is a good reason to practice quick direction changes, to avoid imaginary objects, traffic permitting.
Tom

 

The highest speed attained in a MSF basic course in 20 MPH. I can assure all of you that countersteering starts long before 15 or 20 mph, as previously stated on this thread. As soon as your motorcycle achieves gyroscopic balance, which is pretty close to the"walking speed" of 6mph, countersteering starts working. The "swerve" manuever, which is all countersteering, and part of the MSFtest,is done at a speed of just12-18 mph.

Countersteering is not as intuitive as many here believe. Failure to safely navigate a curve by going wide off the roadwayis the number one way that cyclists kill themselves insingle vehicle accidents. Consciously knowing how to counter steer, and looking through a curve for balance, would prevent those accidents (assuming speed of the motorcyclewas within the limits of the turn).

Here is a link that explains the dynamics of countersteering.

http://www.msgroup.org/tip.aspx?num=048

Jeckll, instead of the term "push," think "Press" instead. "Look left, press left, go left. Look right, press right, go right." Just press gently forward and down at the same angle of your arms on the handle bars.
A good way to practice is to find a straight road with little traffic, with center stripes. Start riding in a straight lineat a slow speed, such as 20 mph, next to the center lines. Then start swerving them by gently doing the press left press right, and you will find it very easy. The harder you press, the more you will lean, and the sharper turn you will be making.

You yourself do not "lean." The motorcycle leans, and you lean with it. Your body stays the same in relationship to the motorcycle.

Many of us here recommend the Ride Like a Pro video, but you should realize that it is already intoadvanced techniques.(Think howexperienced those Motor Officers are that are taking the course). As others have said, you should take a basic MSF or Rider's Edge course and learn the "basics," one of which is countersteering.

For those here who are comfortable with countersteering and swerving, you should be able to swerve the yellow lines in the center of a road at 50 mph or higher without problem. By gently pulling on the opposite handlebar as you press on the other, you can create an even quicker, more controlled swerve. If you practice often, you will be surprised at how quickly you can swerve around a pot hole that suddenly appears in the road. Remember to look for your "path of travel," and not "sight fixate" on what you need to miss.

 

Here is a somewhat simple explanation of countersteer (push right to turn right ect.) First, push right means push the right handlebar forward, which issame as turn the handlebars to the left (right moves forward, left moves back). What that does is instantaniously at the point of contact with the road, kicks the lower half of the bike to the left, creating a lean to the right, and then you and the bike will naturally go to the right....sort of a natural law of physics thing.A lean must happen before a turn is possible, a slight handle turn creates the lean. Here is a short video showing it in practice:http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lxM_G...eature=related

 

my counter stays put,,,, the fridge on the other hand , handles like a dream

 

I agree with rick. If you have rode a bicycle you already know how to do this. Do you need a manual to look at every day to brush your teeth?

Ride the damn bike.

 

MNPGRider- this is probably the best explanation I've read on this subject. I have ridden for so many years, that steering is natural to me and I could never figure out what countersteering was all about. You explained it perfectly.



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Excellent discussion to which I can add only a couple of comments:

The MSF course is excellent--except for the counter steering segment. Aboutall I leftthe course knowing is that the instructor thought counter steering was important. Forget all the confusing push-pull-down-forward-up-out mess and say it simply: "steer left to go right, and steer right to go left."

You will catch on quicker to counter steering if you avoid leaning. Try to stay upright and observe the bike turning under you. In fact it is the leaning that confuses long time riders into thinking steering is natural. Lean steering is natural, but it is a very weak form of counter steering. A rider who doesn't practice counter steering is a head-on waiting to happen.

 

This year, o8, will be 43 yrs on 2 wheels, of every persuaion. Mini, enduro, MX, crotch rocket, road, bagger, chopper (still), and at least 9 different brands. 3 years ago, Momma wanted to get her license. I have taught many people to ride, but this was Momma, and I know how she responds to my input. [:'(]So, she wanted to go to the MRF course. Well, in order toget her to go, she didn't want to go alone, I agreed to go to it just to accompany her and see how many BAD habits I had accumulated in 35+ years. Ihave to say, it was one of the best experiences and more than enlightening. I have mentioned it to others in our club, etc., and numerous ones have tried it out and agreed. They run $125 -$150 up here, and they are very well worth it. If it keeps you from high siding one corner (#1 reason) you'll be $miling all the way home. Just my .o2 worth. BTW- heres Momma and the chop Ride Free Ride Safe Gumby

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EGGS ACT LY!