Defiantly in the eye of the beholder. I will share this. The three fellas who bought the Nightster and the S’s Were not previous Harley owners.. and neither really liked Harley because in their young demographic they are for old fat guys. It was the new styling that got them into looking and it was the capabilities, handling, power and braking that got them to sell their other brands and switch to Harley.. (I’ll take credit it was yours’ truly that brought about an open mind… I beat their bikes with my Harley) So gone from the group are A Yamaha crotch rocket, a V-max and a CBR600 and it was a 2023. It was also the speed of my Harley that opened the eyes of another in my group who’s now looking at a LRST and the 131 motor… so far He’s on the fence.. but understand even if some of the old guard doesn’t like the S or Nightster they are a Segway for many riders who coulda went with other brands because none of them had any loyalty to Harley.

Now define performance. Cause that can mean a lot of things. I gave up crotch rockets in my youth.. it was all about twisties and lean lol. Now I live in Florida where a good portion of the roads have mostly nice open flat straight sections.. so the Hot Rod Springer is a great platform. Taking it and it’s 26 something lean angle to NC made me realize how much I had sacrificed.. but I’m back home where it can shine. Can’t wait to get track time cause I’m confident after running with Busa’s, kz1300, Cb1000r and the like that it will be a 10 second ride. I love it for its classic hot Rod style… it’s not for sale, but an FXR would have been a better platform.

The sportster S & Nightster handle pretty darn well especially being cruisers. These 30 something year old guys are tired of leaning over tanks and both the Harleys are viable options allowing a more comfortable stance and still performing through the twisties. They don’t handle well for being a Harley… they handle well as motorcycles period.

 

You left out a group on that list. There's the small percentage that been deeply into these things a very long time over several generations of machines, Tried and played with most of the popular aftermarket next new thing stuff personally and professionally who know what does work or can tweaked to work, what is snake oil, what should have been pulled off the market long ago, and how do simple things to a stock setup to make it solid.

These are the grumpy ones that became like this over years of dealing with the clueless who think they got it all figured out, hard to watch and gets frustrating. Every new generation coming in just know they know more those old guys cause they saw it on the Internet, paid shills called influencers, shops or whatever are talking it up or the get my 15 minutes on youtube bunch.

The real annoying ones come in asking questions or wanting opinions about something, not looking for real input or suggestions, they'll ignore it all till somebody says what they wanted to hear. When it goes sideways, won't own it, blame is placed on bad advice they got somewhere else.

 

i had a lot of fun on Harley's through the years, they are loud and pretty...and did I mention....um....they sound good

as well, I was excited to hear they are full in on the woke movement, platinum members of the lgbgt chamber of commerce....they are sending their leaders to sensitivity training and even hosted a big inclusive bash at the headquarters just for those who'd appreciate the 'safe space' they provided

and like you said....lol....they um.....are....and I quote 'Harley’s are fast and can have a measure of reliability.'....i had a hard time keeping a straight face when i read that one....so how much of a measure of reliability....a whole bike full....just a teaspoon....'a measure' is a little arbitrary

 

Because I mistakenly thought you might have something interesting to say for a change, but no, you are just posting more of the same crap.

I don`t hate you, but the subject of the different groups of people who own Harley Davidsons has been long since been beaten to death, it really gets boring.

When you make a post, people will respond, if you don`t like the response, too bad.

 

I mean people could be on the other end of things. You could own a kawasaki or Suzuki where options for a bigbore kit on a bike you really like lands somewhere between Fawk All and Nothing.
HD bikes, most of their owners are utterly spoiled for choice. I'm sure there's at least 6 different cams that I could put in my bike that'd I'd never be able to tell the difference between.
I mean look at Indian's aftermarket, it's kids meal options compared to the cheese cake factory menu we get for Baggers and Softails.
IIRC for the Gen1 Chief and Cheiftain, there was a TOTAL of 10 exhaust systems available for literally 15 different models of bikes Indian made.
There's more 15 options available specific to just MY model of bike alone.
Ill take an aftermarket that's thriving and flooded, over a total drought for parts and accessories for years or the entire lifespan of the bike I purchased.

 

Basically you know I concur,
The whole subject of Harley performance is strange, especially in this forum. Everyone is looking for the cam or the tune or the stage.

But actually mention that you race a Harley or want to beat the next lane over, and it’s Harley’s are for cruising! go buy a plastic big 4 Japanese bike if you want to go fast, and if that’s true, why are you doing all these EPA strangled changes then?

Todays Harley have more then a 50% increase in cc compared to when the 80 incher was the bigger of the Big twins.
My first modded HD motor was a 80:inch Shovel, than I did the Evo. Coming from that a 121 factory engine should not need anything.

I did it, 'cause I wanted to go faster and quicker. And my response has always been I know and everyone knows a ‘Busa is fast, but it’s way more fun to make a slow bike go fast!

 

The thing is, that Kawasaki or Suzuki is probably plenty fast out of the box and doesn't need a bigbore kit to flatten your eyeballs if that's what you want. As for handling, well let's not even go there.

(geez, I hope the OP doesn't hate me for "hating on Harley").

 

Askholes

 

My Harleys go plenty fast enough for me, but I still tinker a bit here and there.

 

There have been a lot of hyped up products that didn’t work over the years haven’t there.. lol. I do get grumpy myself with some of the things that just won’t die and go away. Part of it though is there are things that in one combination and set up don’t work and then in another do. That confusion adds to the mystery and VooDoo