Started cam change on 99 TC88 ultra
#11
Sorry to hear about your Father. I've been there already and know exactly what you're dealing with. I wouldn't wish that on anybody.
As far as your cam choice, a 203 is very hard to tune to. My friend the engine builder always ask guys with 203's if when they are cruising at a steady speed does it feel like something is holding them back and then letting them go? Most of them look at him funny and say YES! Somebody use to make a 4 degree advance gear. Maybe somebody can chime in and give you a name. The best thing you can do if you're going to use Harley cams is to get the 204 and a 4 degree advance gear. This will close your intake at 30 degrees ABDC. This will give you great low end grunt and still rev out fine. If nobody makes this gear anymore then I'd still go with the 204. It closes the intake 2 degrees sooner than the 203 and is much easier to tune to. IMHO.
Now go take care of Dad and make sure to ask him all those questions you've always wanted to. Might want to video it too. I wish I had!
As far as your cam choice, a 203 is very hard to tune to. My friend the engine builder always ask guys with 203's if when they are cruising at a steady speed does it feel like something is holding them back and then letting them go? Most of them look at him funny and say YES! Somebody use to make a 4 degree advance gear. Maybe somebody can chime in and give you a name. The best thing you can do if you're going to use Harley cams is to get the 204 and a 4 degree advance gear. This will close your intake at 30 degrees ABDC. This will give you great low end grunt and still rev out fine. If nobody makes this gear anymore then I'd still go with the 204. It closes the intake 2 degrees sooner than the 203 and is much easier to tune to. IMHO.
Now go take care of Dad and make sure to ask him all those questions you've always wanted to. Might want to video it too. I wish I had!
#12
#13
A good tuner will have no problem tuning the SE203. Actually, with more ground in advance the SE204 presents more tuning problems. Neither cam is difficult to tune unless the compression envelope is being pushed. Stay conservative on compression and tuning will not be an issue.
I would agree that the Andrews 21 or 26 would be better choices but have been under the impression that the OP had already selected the SE203 cams.
Woods and Andrews make the 4* advance gear. Hemrick Performance also makes an adjustable timing gear that allows advancing and retarding cam timimg +/-10*.
I would agree that the Andrews 21 or 26 would be better choices but have been under the impression that the OP had already selected the SE203 cams.
Woods and Andrews make the 4* advance gear. Hemrick Performance also makes an adjustable timing gear that allows advancing and retarding cam timimg +/-10*.
#14
Update on TC88 Cam change
well, I got the cam chest opened up tongiht and have a few pic's to share. the tensioners are definatly showing wear, this is the inner wear pad. the outer pad looks the same. the cam's are in reasonably good condition and I am contemplating holding off on the full cam change until more cash comes available to go gear drive. I only have .0015" of crank runout, so i'd be a good donor for the geardrive upgrade. So, taking the short way out with tensioners for now, adding a PC USBIII for the intake and exhaust change and let her rip for another 30K miles.
#15
Service manual says to replace when tensioner pad is worn 50%; you're just about there. Pads are evenly worn, some pitting but no cracks or missing corners. You should get another 50K out of new tensioners; your old chain is already "polished". While you have the cam chest open, might as well change both inner and outer cam bearings; cheap and easy to do withoug special tools using the "freezer_oven method" on the outers. For sure replace the inners and you will need a puller for that. Replace the oring between the oil pump and cam plate, at the dowel between the case and cam plate at 7:00 postion and the oring at the oii pump/scavenge port connection. If you can manage another $12, upgrade to the Baisley LMR-002 bypass valve spring. Bearings and springs are pretty cheap upgrade and will help insure that you get as many miles in the future as you want or need before upgrading cams.
With .0015" runout, a gear drive setup is certainly an option; however, you should consider upgrading the new hydro tensioner/roller chain cam drive; much easier to install and work on. There is not real advantage to gear drives since the hydro tensioner setup came along. The tensioner issue has been resolved and, unless you are drag racing and trying to squeeze every fraction of TQ/HP from the build. JMHO
With .0015" runout, a gear drive setup is certainly an option; however, you should consider upgrading the new hydro tensioner/roller chain cam drive; much easier to install and work on. There is not real advantage to gear drives since the hydro tensioner setup came along. The tensioner issue has been resolved and, unless you are drag racing and trying to squeeze every fraction of TQ/HP from the build. JMHO
#16
Just an update, I get to pick up my cam plate from dealer tonight and start reassembly. Took a few days to get all the parts together. Figures though, about the time I get it together it starts snowing here in Maryland again. Been watching all the builds going on and problems everyone has been having. I don't thave the alignment pins for the oil pump, are they really necessary< I mean can I get away with a couple of long shanked headless bolts and do the same thing? I pick up the cam service kit tomorrow morning and I hope all the seals and gaskets are in there. Don't need any surprises halfway through assembly. Let you know how it turns out. Especially when I start tuning with PC USBIII
#17
Just an update, I get to pick up my cam plate from dealer tonight and start reassembly. Took a few days to get all the parts together. Figures though, about the time I get it together it starts snowing here in Maryland again. Been watching all the builds going on and problems everyone has been having. I don't thave the alignment pins for the oil pump, are they really necessary< I mean can I get away with a couple of long shanked headless bolts and do the same thing? I pick up the cam service kit tomorrow morning and I hope all the seals and gaskets are in there. Don't need any surprises halfway through assembly. Let you know how it turns out. Especially when I start tuning with PC USBIII
#18
#19
On my recent build, pressing in the bearings and cams was the only thing I had done by someone else, other than the head work by Hillside. My local stealer, and I do mean stealer, Blocker, quoted me $70/hr and the job would take 20 minutes. So $24 to press in bearings and cams. Money well spent, or so I thought. I go to pickup the cam plate, cams, bearing, and inner chain in place, and I see a bill for $74 and change. I say "WTF is this?, you told me 20 minutes" Well it took longer than we thought, they say. Bullsheet, I say. Then I look at the inner chain. The stupid asses put it in upside down. They say it doesn't matter because you're putting in a new set of cams. I say, it DOES matter because that's not the way I told you to do it. I marked an X on the side facing up and I wanted it put back the same way. So, they took everything apart and put it back the way I told them to do it beforehand, then I paid the $74 bill. I will never spend another dime at that dealer.
#20
I don’t think you need the alignment pins. I just put my cam chest all back together after updating the cam plate to an ’07 hydraulic plate and Andrew’s 26N. Even though I used the alignment pins, I still rotated the rear tire and this is what I noticed. The alignment pins were a little resistant to screw in with my fingers until I rotated the rear wheel. Once I started to rotate the rear wheel both the alignment pins and the other 2 bolts screwed in very easily with my fingers. Point being, while rotating the rear wheel, the pump aligned itself to the cam plate. So whether you use alignment pins or just the 4 pump bolts, it doesn’t matter as long as you rotate the rear tire. Actually I’d argue using the alignment pins and not rotating the rear wheel, you might very well torque down a mis-aligned pump.
Did mine without the pins. Have a friend spin the tire, with spark plugs removed, while slowly tightening the 4 bolts per manual spec.