I sold my Shovel to a friend, who has it on the road again. (Over 250,000 miles on it and a number of rebuilds.) I'm in the process of gathering up all the parts to trash the MM FI and put a carb on my EVO. In the mean time I'm riding it. Mileage isn't a huge issue to me as I do my own wrenching and save the labor charges. Beside, those MMI grads don't know how to work on anything older than a twinkie.

 

For what its worth, I went from Twin Cam back to an Evo. I like the 1998 Evo Ultra. I don't ride hard so the wobble doesn't effect me. I have noticed it at 85 MPH but who needs to go that fast?
Lists of things I'm doing:
Upgrading to OEM brakes from an 08
Swapping in a 6 speed gear set with hydraulic clutch
Upgrading the swing arm bushings and motor mounts
Future upgrade:
S&S 95 Motor with carb
Other than than, putting miles on her

 

as far as mileage of the old evos, ive personally seen a 1994 with 175k on it, no bottom end work done either. i believe he told me three top ends.

 

I would not walk away from an Evo at any mileage, but at 50K you can expect a top end, and around 100K a bottom end, your results may vary. I have seen many a evo with over 100K on it, some over 200K even. At the higher mileages, I would consider going through the motor/ drivetrain mandatory, especially on a bike you're planning on going far from home on. But, when it comes to bikes I have a bit of OCD, this might not always be necessary.

OTOH, if you buy a Twinkie, you DEFINATELY HAVE TO replace the cam chain tensioner BEFORE 50K, not an option, and IMO, geardrive cams ($$$) are mandatory whenever you get time to replace the stockers. I have seen more than one (stock, never been opened) Twinkie eat the tensioner shoe by 50K. This problem appears to be worse on the early twinkies, but I would not run chaindrive cams in my personal bike (if I owned a TC), other than the ride home from buying it. In the TC's defense, it is easier to big bore, the engine has more fin surface for cooling, and the (stock) heads flow better with better potential after porting. Also, parts are everywhere and you can get repairs done at any dealer if you're on the road.

The biggest thing to look for on the older baggers, particuarly the Ultras, is the potential for a wiring nightmare. Unless you're handy with electrical, or plan on ripping it all out, RUN, don't walk away from anything with questionable wiring or signs of electrical problems. Keep in mind that most bikes shouldn't have any issue, but I've seen some pretty amazing birdnests over the years. I would also avoid the early (pre 97?) MM FI baggers, no need to worry about an older EFI system if you don't have to.

Keep in mind, as a lot of others on the board have done, that you can pick up an older EVO with lots of miles for cheap, and throw in a nasty crate motor and 6 speed, and have a hell of a touring bike for the same or less than a late model Twinkie. If you end up with an older bike, make sure you have a local Dealer or Indy that knows how to take care of it if you are not going to do the work yourself. Also, an older bike full of newer parts and retrofits is going to be a great bike, no doubt, but if you ever have issues on the road you better know what parts you need, because most service depts won't, at least w/o tearing into the bike, that is if they even have parts in stock for older bikes. This shouldn't be as much of an issue with a later Evo compared to an early Evo. This can be avoided/ minimized by careful parts selection and retrofitting newer OEM stuff, but consider yourself forewarned.

Regardless of what style you choose, my personal mandatory list for a bagger would be: Cam and associated parts (80HP/ 80TQ minimum), 6 speed (If you spend time at 65+) and possibly deeper final gearing, Truetrac, Aftermarket shocks and suspension, and stickier rubber, think Metzeler or Avon. And whatever it takes to make it comfortable for hours on end. But, I think of baggers like cars, you should be able to hop on and ride anywhere, comfortably and reliably, in any weather.

 

Evo baggers, prices in the $8500 range in areas, just witnessed a low mile 98 RK bought for this price. Unlimited modifications, simple reliable engine with cheap power available.

I don't have any experiance on a Twinkie but ride side by side with them on trips, nothing wows me with them, expecially for the price differance and my 89" gets better mpg and outpulls them. I enjoy looking at all of the money owners spend on Twinkie baggers due to my Evo RK is surrounded by thousands of Twinkies at a bike night and don't have much of a choice.

I'm sure late models have their advantages and plenty of performance parts available, I personally think Evo baggers are like a good wine, gets better with time and I like mine more every year that passes.

The greatest advantage of a Evo purchase is you get a lifetime rights of passage to THE EVO forum

 

No probs Tucker-- happy to respond.

Well the 09's and up I believe ARE a better bike than my 96 Glide. Just look at all the upgrades and improvements on paper at face value and that alone, to me, says it all.
I can live with the hot running motor-- I change all fluids frequently, (which I did on the 96 as well) have a stage 1 with a SEST fuel tuner which is set up to remove the OEM lean condition, and an oil cooler.

Now about that attachment to the 96 Glide-- well sir I loved the old girl-- she ran cool and well, caused no problems, never left me on the side, was fairly forgiving, I did ALL the maintence by the book,and she pulled stumps out fo the ground. One can't ask for more that that.
I honestly had a very difficult time regarding the decision to go with an 09, and when I was negotiating the sale I was having second thoughts--but as mentioned I was made an offer by the dealer on an 09 Ultra that was way to good to pass up and I wanted the 'improvements' as I call them.

Is it $20k better? No it isn't-- but if you ask the same question when drivers change cages you'll likely get the same answer. By nature, people like "new things" for various reasons. I wanted cruise, ABS, better handling, good sounds, more chrome etc-- remember I was riding a 96 Standard which had none of the above save the added TP and lowers-- so it was, as I called it, a "poor mans Ultra".

I know this doesn't answer your question, but I would be happy if I would have upgraded to a late model EVO Ultra!

Now about that handling on the 96 that you and gsxrboy wrote about. I could have helped this with a frame stabilisation gadget, maybe rebuild the swingarm, tried tires other than the Dunflops and ME 880s (the 880s DID make a bit of a diff).
The tailwag was really only evident when I was pushing it harder into curves, or lane swapping faster than I should have been-- as in out on the edge a bit. I always took it as a sign to slow down. If I didn't push it to the edge I never noticed it.
With the 09 if I push it to the edge it just hangs there like it should and I feel totally in control-- as I should.

At the end of the day I was never interested in a twin cam at all until the 09s hit the decks. It was then that I felt the total sum of improvements over the in between years of 99-08 which helped create the 09 and newer models made me sit up and take notice-- that plus the deal I was offered was the kicker!

I would be happy to throw my leg over a late model EVO touring model in a heartbeat with confidence that it wll go the distance comfortably and confidently.

your questions:
2) Power. I've read here that an Andrews cam, period, put's you right there with 96 CI'ers. True or False?
[False-- I think if your comparing EVO tyo 96 inch you'll need a complementing cam and exhaust system, improved carb or FI mgmt system [and possibly headwork?] to pull with a well setup Stage 1 96 inch thanks to the longer legs of the 6 speed and more cubes. JMHO!] You might keep up at the bottom end for a bit but those long legs will pull away from you through the top end-- again just my opinion based on SoP (Seat of Pants) dyno.

4) Brakes. Not sure but my Heritage has a single rotor on the front and I don't have any problems. Not sure if I buy into that ABS stuff. If you brake correctly in the first place you shouldn't need it.

[Much better brakes on the 09+ both in feel and stopping power. You shouldn't need ABS but when the idiot in the cage turns in front of you ABS can be a big help when you have to start instantly concentrating on your "exit strategy."]

5) Vibration: Don't know. (btw touring motors are rubbermount with no counterbalance feature as for the 'B' motors)
My 09 motor shakes a bit less at idle than my Evo did. Running through the gears is about the same, and at fixed highway speeds the 09 has a slight edge with less vibes-- not much in it though....note that individual motors could have a little less or a little more due to manufacturing tolerances.

6) Sound: Now this area is very subjective... After a decade on loud pipes I have had enough. With the stage 1, I put on SE touring slip ons with changeable end caps. Its' quiet enough not to pish off the neighbors when riding out, but loud enough when you roll on that it sounds OK to me.
I also want to listen to the sound system at normal volumes so another reason for me to ride a bit more quietly. Again, very subjective and to each their own!

I realise that my opinions above may not necessarily be agreed with and that's fine. I respect others inputs, opinions, and ideas, and welcome all comments.

Take care Tucker, and let us know which way you go!

 

Some awesome opinion/write-ups on this thread! Answers lots of questions that are going through my head. Well done!

 

Yea! Too much excitement is not good for some of us. My shovel was a kicker - never again!

 

My plan is to buy a 90,s touring bike , install a sure track system,a good radio system of some kind. Takeout the HD gear set, install new Ultima 6 speed with a chain rear drive,upgrade my clutch, and istall the new Ultima 124 Bagger motor..150 HP , I can,t resist this, good bike with out a huge investment and I don,t need th HD shop to help me keep it running ...

 

My plan was a bone stock 90's tourer. But after a few months, the MM EFI's lack of economy got to me and I'm removing it and putting a stock carb settup on it. Other than that, I'm staying stock. Stock worked well on my Ironhead and on my old Shovel. My bagger is for touring, when I want performance, I have other choices in the stable.