Fm 107 vs stage 4 103 (no brainer right?)
#11
06-11-2015 | 09:09 PM
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Cruiser
Joined: Sep 2014
Posts: 158
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From: Santa Rosa
Have two friends that have had dealer installed and tuned SE 103 Stage IV kits; one the race kit and one the street kit. Both had rideability issues and were disappointed with the results. Torque cam on late and bikes were almost unrideable below 3000rpms. The dealer tunes were the main reason why both builds had issues. One resolved the issue with a proper tune; peak numbers increased marginally but the big difference was the performance at partial throttle; the guy was very happy with the results but still wanted the torque to come in a bit earlier. The other guy resolve his issue by replacing the 259 with the S&S 585 and a retune; tuned by the same tuner. The guy is over the moon with the difference in performance.
I don't know what your goals are but having been there and done that, I would stick with a 107" build, good heads, larger throttle body, better cams and go for a 120/120 motor and not as hard on the bank account as a 117" motor. A 117" requires the lower unit to be pulled for case boring, Timken conversion and crank work; expensive. If you want a bigger, badder motor, spend a little more money and call the S&S guys up for one of their 124" motors.
I don't know what your goals are but having been there and done that, I would stick with a 107" build, good heads, larger throttle body, better cams and go for a 120/120 motor and not as hard on the bank account as a 117" motor. A 117" requires the lower unit to be pulled for case boring, Timken conversion and crank work; expensive. If you want a bigger, badder motor, spend a little more money and call the S&S guys up for one of their 124" motors.
#12
06-11-2015 | 09:49 PM
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Cruiser
Joined: Sep 2014
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From: Santa Rosa
I just looked into it more. Your right. They are factory CNC ported heads.
#13
06-11-2015 | 11:54 PM
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Cruiser
Joined: Sep 2014
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From: Santa Rosa
117" engines run very well.
From road tractor builds, to street scorchers.
S&S cams, Wood cams, Andrews cams, and Lieneweber cams have all been used here with various cylinder heads/throttle body, and/or carb configruations, along with a plethora of exhaust systems.
Built so many now that I've lost count.
FWIW, all of the work stays in-house on those.
Scott
From road tractor builds, to street scorchers.
S&S cams, Wood cams, Andrews cams, and Lieneweber cams have all been used here with various cylinder heads/throttle body, and/or carb configruations, along with a plethora of exhaust systems.
Built so many now that I've lost count.
FWIW, all of the work stays in-house on those.
Scott
#14
06-11-2015 | 11:55 PM
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Cruiser
Joined: Sep 2014
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From: Santa Rosa
Are you running the stock Pistons still?
#15
06-12-2015 | 03:47 AM
Road Warrior
Joined: Jun 2010
Posts: 1,368
Likes: 27
From: Australia
The stage 4 race kit performs well, you can sell tuner that comes with it or get a rebate from the dealer, you will need 58mm air cleaner kit ( round model or heavy breather)
You would get around 105/105 upto around 115/115 depending on dyno machine hehehehehe, 259e an underrated cam and if you like racing it goes well,
the driveability, low speed riding, idling is a non-issue and tweaking the efi parameters of the tune is all thats needed, tuner can do that or do on computer
You would get around 105/105 upto around 115/115 depending on dyno machine hehehehehe, 259e an underrated cam and if you like racing it goes well,
the driveability, low speed riding, idling is a non-issue and tweaking the efi parameters of the tune is all thats needed, tuner can do that or do on computer
Last edited by mirrmu; 06-12-2015 at 06:06 AM.
#16
06-12-2015 | 05:28 AM
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The 117 is definitely the end goal. But it's going to be a while before I'm ready to get in the bottom end. If I could get a set of heads, a cam, bump up my compression and reuse those parts when I do the 117. That would be money well spent I'm thinking. But I really have no idea.
Those along with a Wood 8, or T-Man .590 would work now, and also with the 117, for example.
Scott
#17
06-12-2015 | 11:09 AM
Road Master
Joined: Jan 2009
Posts: 796
Likes: 0
From: Mission Viejo, CA
Have two friends that have had dealer installed and tuned SE 103 Stage IV kits; one the race kit and one the street kit. Both had rideability issues and were disappointed with the results. Torque cam on late and bikes were almost unrideable below 3000rpms. The dealer tunes were the main reason why both builds had issues. One resolved the issue with a proper tune; peak numbers increased marginally but the big difference was the performance at partial throttle; the guy was very happy with the results but still wanted the torque to come in a bit earlier. The other guy resolve his issue by replacing the 259 with the S&S 585 and a retune; tuned by the same tuner. The guy is over the moon with the difference in performance.
I don't know what your goals are but having been there and done that, I would stick with a 107" build, good heads, larger throttle body, better cams and go for a 120/120 motor and not as hard on the bank account as a 117" motor. A 117" requires the lower unit to be pulled for case boring, Timken conversion and crank work; expensive. If you want a bigger, badder motor, spend a little more money and call the S&S guys up for one of their 124" motors.
I don't know what your goals are but having been there and done that, I would stick with a 107" build, good heads, larger throttle body, better cams and go for a 120/120 motor and not as hard on the bank account as a 117" motor. A 117" requires the lower unit to be pulled for case boring, Timken conversion and crank work; expensive. If you want a bigger, badder motor, spend a little more money and call the S&S guys up for one of their 124" motors.
#18
06-12-2015 | 11:24 AM
[QUOTE=Hillsidecycle.com;14107257]Our Stage III Super-Tour Heads support 117"s, and can be used with a 103".
Those along with a Wood 8, or T-Man .590 would work now, and also with the 117, for example.
Scott[/QUOTE
103 with the 590, compression, nice heads, and tb is what i have been looking myself. depending on funds and miles at the time i may bore my cylinders to 107. as always thats good info .....thanks scott.
Those along with a Wood 8, or T-Man .590 would work now, and also with the 117, for example.
Scott[/QUOTE
103 with the 590, compression, nice heads, and tb is what i have been looking myself. depending on funds and miles at the time i may bore my cylinders to 107. as always thats good info .....thanks scott.
#19
06-12-2015 | 11:38 AM
HDF Community Team
Joined: Jun 2006
Posts: 12,259
Likes: 2,233
From: san antonio
Hey, I tried to talk the both out it and offered to help with an aftermarket build but these were both new to Harleys and were reluctant to step outside the Harley box. Both were offered warranty protection from the dealers, so it was a hard sell. They both now call me whenever they are considering a modification, even a tire change; they don't call the dealer.
#20
06-12-2015 | 03:35 PM
Hey, I tried to talk the both out it and offered to help with an aftermarket build but these were both new to Harleys and were reluctant to step outside the Harley box. Both were offered warranty protection from the dealers, so it was a hard sell. They both now call me whenever they are considering a modification, even a tire change; they don't call the dealer.