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trouble after build **long post**

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  #1  
Old 09-16-2009 | 02:24 PM
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swf913
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Default trouble after build **long post**

Okay, here's what I mentioned wanting your opinions on.
I had a 95 kit w/510G S&S cams an adj. ign. module installed w/dyno tune from what I understood to be a reputable builder (bike already had Mikuni 42 and Samson Big Gun 3s). His shop being ~1 hr away I thought I'd ride the bike home. I'd stopped a moment to make a phone call and when I went to re-start the bike the engine kicked back against the starter hard. It did this on a handful of occasions. It seemed I could prevent it at times by opening the throttle as I pushed starter button. Well I spent Sunday sight-seeing in D.C. and when I stopped for gas and again for a meal en-route home....it didn't want to start, simply cracking with a metallic "clip" every rotation, back-firing out exhaust and once through the carb before finally starting. The seconded time I rode approx. 1/4 mile before lights flickered and I lose all power, everything dead. I got a ride home returning with tools and trailer. Pulled the seat off and found both battery terminals loose. Tightened them, fired it up and rode home. Seemed to start easier afterward, but returned to builder Monday. They did nothing but attempting to start it repeatedly with no problem. Said the loose terminals caused it but won't admit to leaving them loose. Now I did replace the battery about a month ago, that being a couple weeks before they worked on it. I had no problems before this and I've been wrenching on cars for years, too many years....I don't leave bolts loose generally, most certainly not when it's an electrical component. I should also mention that the day I picked the bike up, before arriving home I found a loose rockerbox-cover bolt ready to fall out and there was slight leakage. There are also a few other things I'm not satisfied with, but I realize I'm a particular person when it comes to paying someone to work on my....stuff. Anyway, just wanted your thoughts. Suppose I loose the starter or ring gear in time due to the engine kicking back, (which it did again yesterday) who's baby is that generally? I'd think it the builder, I'd voiced my concerns about going 10.25:1 prior to the work but was assured the trick was in the tune...which is their claim to fame.....Judge for yourselves if this dyno chart means anything...90hp 113tq. Oh yeah, she'll run...if you can get 'er started.
 
  #2  
Old 09-16-2009 | 06:36 PM
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Ram
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Originally Posted by swf913
Okay, here's what I mentioned wanting your opinions on.
I had a 95 kit w/510G S&S cams an adj. ign. module installed w/dyno tune from what I understood to be a reputable builder (bike already had Mikuni 42 and Samson Big Gun 3s). His shop being ~1 hr away I thought I'd ride the bike home. I'd stopped a moment to make a phone call and when I went to re-start the bike the engine kicked back against the starter hard. It did this on a handful of occasions. It seemed I could prevent it at times by opening the throttle as I pushed starter button. Well I spent Sunday sight-seeing in D.C. and when I stopped for gas and again for a meal en-route home....it didn't want to start, simply cracking with a metallic "clip" every rotation, back-firing out exhaust and once through the carb before finally starting. The seconded time I rode approx. 1/4 mile before lights flickered and I lose all power, everything dead. I got a ride home returning with tools and trailer. Pulled the seat off and found both battery terminals loose. Tightened them, fired it up and rode home. Seemed to start easier afterward, but returned to builder Monday. They did nothing but attempting to start it repeatedly with no problem. Said the loose terminals caused it but won't admit to leaving them loose. Now I did replace the battery about a month ago, that being a couple weeks before they worked on it. I had no problems before this and I've been wrenching on cars for years, too many years....I don't leave bolts loose generally, most certainly not when it's an electrical component. I should also mention that the day I picked the bike up, before arriving home I found a loose rockerbox-cover bolt ready to fall out and there was slight leakage. There are also a few other things I'm not satisfied with, but I realize I'm a particular person when it comes to paying someone to work on my....stuff. Anyway, just wanted your thoughts. Suppose I loose the starter or ring gear in time due to the engine kicking back, (which it did again yesterday) who's baby is that generally? I'd think it the builder, I'd voiced my concerns about going 10.25:1 prior to the work but was assured the trick was in the tune...which is their claim to fame.....Judge for yourselves if this dyno chart means anything...90hp 113tq. Oh yeah, she'll run...if you can get 'er started.
Things happen. Even the most conscientious wrench can either miss a torque, loc-tight or even a bolt or two. Give it a Safe for ride inspection on all the critical components a couple times. Take out the battery and charge it fully before running it any more. Then tighten good upon reinstall.

Don't be so hard on your indy, you burn a bridge now, you have nothing if something major happens. Just keep notes of what all you think that may have been from your indy for future reference if you have anything catastrophic fail.

If this was a Honda Goldwing then I'd say go after him they run smooth like an electric motor and things wouldn't have vibrated loose.

Since this is a Milwaukee Great American vibrator were talking about with over stock CR, its going to loosen up a nut or bolt on an occasion. May even get hot too.

Sorry it may not be all what your expecting to hear.

Have you thought about doing your own wrenching? I do.
 
  #3  
Old 09-16-2009 | 07:17 PM
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Lonewolf176
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I wouldn't be happy about the loose stuff, but sounds like heat soak. Did you install compression releases? What's it tuned with?
 
  #4  
Old 09-16-2009 | 07:19 PM
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0734
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From: Summit, Mississippi
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Check out the battery for sure, but it could be something happening in the starter wiring or starter guts too. If the solenoid is not holding in for one of several reasons, it could be kicking back in the compression stroke as the starter shaft is retracted prematurely. This will certainly happen with loose battery connections and go over your chassis ground from the battery to the frame real good too. If it did it all the time, which yours don't, I'd also suspect timing, both mechanical and electrical.

I just make it a point to install a starter button on the solenoid end cover on all my bikes. If you push that button and it acts up, you have isolated any starter circuit problem down to a motor, solenoid contacts or overrunning clutch. You have removed the starter button, starter relay and solenoid from the loop. That button will take any "bounce" out of the disc attached to the plunger pulled-in by the soleniod. It's about $15 installs in 5-minutes, is a good diagnostic tool and will cause you to clean the contact surfaces on the plunger disk and solenoid terminals while you have that cover off.
 
  #5  
Old 09-17-2009 | 08:39 PM
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Ram
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http://www.spyke1.com/starterparts.htm

Here is the link to Spyke starter button.
 
  #6  
Old 09-22-2009 | 04:21 PM
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I wanted to jump back in here and thank everyone for their input, I'm considering the Spyke starter button mod for this winter. As for doing all my own wrenching, I have little desire for getting to deep into it. Just as many of you my free time is limited and I prefer using it in other areas of interest while paying the knowledgeable for their expertise. Since having tightened the battery terminals I've had very little trouble starting it and of the two instances one was clearly my fault, twisting the throttle on a warm engine without thinking, duh. Thanks again gentlemen.
 
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