I am enjoying every ride I get. Turns are getting better and better. It really is a sweet ride. I have to contact the dealer tommorow though. The air cleaner cover says Street Bob instead of Wide Glide. I cant believe it. Anyway gonna have that replaced and get the bolt for the battery cover. I am watching the road surface on those turns. Boy what a ride though. I love the Wide Glide!! Im gonna try like hell to ride mine every day too.

Steve

 

You're right you have to keep an eye out for debris, and you just took the class so you already know this, but you really need to keep your head up and look out to the exit of a turn to be really steady. Same with starts and stops. Keep your eyes up and out and looking where you're going. Can you imagine trying to learn to roller skate while looking down at the skates? Your best sense of balance comes from keeping your head up and looking directly at where you want to go. The bike tends to go where you look.

As I said, I know they taught you that but it's still hard to remember at first...

Question? In your safety class did they teach you to counter-steer the bike, aka reverse-steer? I mean, to press forward on the bars toward the direction you want to go?

Here in Oregon you have to know that to pass the test and get the endorsement, but I just talked to someone from another state who took a course, got the endorsement and had no idea what I'm talking about. Shocking.

Ride safe.

 

Ain't got nothin against you learning to counter steer Butt !
I looked at the countersteering. I been riding since 1964. Its nots nothin I'm interested in doing. It was hard but I tried it and nearly laid a scooter down in a curve.
MY wife was taking the Riders Edge Course and she was taught to conter steer at a well know H-D dealership.They had a 3 nite and 2 day class.
I talked with the instructor about the countersteering and told him I tried it. The instructor suggested that as long as I had been riding he would suggest for me not to practise counter steering. To ride like I have always rode a street bike and dirt bikes.
The instructor stated if I been riding as long as I have and i'm still in one piece, he wouldn't suggest for me to change anything. Especially trying to lean to countersteer.
This is something for new riders to learn in my book. It totally goes against everything I've ever done. My old riding buddies say the same thing. If we've rode since the 60's why do we need to learn to counter steer.
So from more than one instructors mouth. Older folks should do like they have been doing.

 

I almost could have written your post.
I bought an 07 WG for my 60th - sort of an early retirement because I will probably have to work until I die.
Last rode on dirt about 22 years ago.

I love the bike and also have some issues with the turn from a stop.
I think most of my problem is not looking through the turn.

The countersteering threw me at first then I realized that was what I had always done but just didn't think about it.
It sort of reminds me of when someone asks for my phone number or I sit down in front of my computer and try to remember my password.
In both cases I trip myself up because I am trying to think about something that comes natural.
If I just do it, I am fine but if I think about it, I confuse myself.

Anyhow, I plan on keeping my WG stock so what do I know.

Enjoy your new toy and stay safe.

 

This a copy/paste of a conversation I had earlierwith a gal who had a new fatboy. I hope someone finds it helpful. Counter steering was like a miracle for this gal who pm'd me later. She hadn't ridden before at all, couldn't turn the bike at speed and was in real danger. She had just taken a rider's safety course and gotten her endorsement. Wow, please read?

Welcome. I hope they teach that in all these rider safety courses. Every time I hear of an accident where "rider failed to negotiate a turn" I wonder.

It's based onfour principles: Centrifugal force, gyroscopic precession,"The Dixie Cup Theory" and leverage.

1. Centifugal force will try to force the bike off the road to the outside in a turn.

2. Gyroscopic precession (ever play with a toy gyroscope?) will cause the wheels to generate unwanted and opposingforces when turned.

3. The real kicker, the Dixie Cups is like this. Lay such a cup on it's side on a table and roll it. It will turn toward the bottom of the cup because the drinking lip is bigger in diameter than the base.

4. Leverage. Your handlebar is a lever.

Now, tape twoDixie Cups or similar cupstogether, drinking rims together and bases pointing outward.Lay them on a table. Roll this new device. It will turn in the direction that it is tipped; toward either base. Your tire is just like that; bigger in the middle than toward the edges.

Whichever way your tires tip is the direction the bike will go. The counter-steer just gives you theleverage to tip it and the "Dixie Cup Theory" does the rest. This need to turn to the outside edge of the tire overcomes precession, centrifugal force and even the clearfact that your front wheel is slightly turned opposite of the way you wish to turn.

The handlebars are terrific levers which, out at the grips give you the power to tip that bike with ease, class, and total control.

You exit a turn the same way. Push forward on the handlebar in the newdirection you want to go. The bike will straighten right up for you. You can do wonderful "S" turns or slalom turns this way with ease.

I can safely and easily scrapesome shined up parts on your Harley in a sharp corner any day if the road is sound, dry and clean.

Stay safe,

JB

 

If you've been riding a motorcycle for long and have rode a dirt bike. you slide around on the seat. you slide from the front of the seat to the back of the seat to the sides of the seat and lean the bike to keep in where you want it.
My wife took the MSF course at a dealer. She came home talking about countersteeting, I tried it in a curve doing 65, felt like my forks were gong to fold under my bike. I talke to her instructor. He told me if I've been riding since 1964 and am here to talk about it not to think about countersteeting. I must be doing something right.

 

Cardboard, I bet your are counter steering and just don't realize it.... I was. I grew up in the dirt as well. Lean, shift your weight,and twist the throttle. Well, while performing that maneuver, you're unintentionally applying counter steer. Regardless, you ride, bike turns, all is well!

 

I think that if you negotiate a curve moving at about 15mph or more, you've countersteered whether you know it or not.

I'll try to explain the best I can from my perspective, but I think JBaker's advice is best -- get out on a road and countersteer back and forth to really appreciate what is going on.

If you need to negotiate a right-hand curve, youshould push forward on your right hand-grip slightly to initiate thelean. You do not keep onpushing forward on the right-hand grip, you onlypush to initiate the desired lean angle.

Now that you're leaning to your right (and turning by the way), you then make adjustments thereafter depending on what lane position you wish to hold.

For a right-hand curve, if you notice you're approaching the white line at the outside of you're lane and wish to go back towards the center yellow lines,you do not need as much lean, soa slight correctionby pushing forward on your left-hand gripwillincrease your turning radius and push you towards the center yellow lines.

The same works in reverse. If you're closing in on the yellow center lines, and wish to move towards thewhite lineaway from on-coming traffic, you push slightly forward on the right-hand grip, making the bike lean more to decrease the turning radius and you'll turn harder back to the inside of the curve.

Counter-steering isnot necessarily an exaggerated movement that is easilyidentifiable.It's often a subtle motion combined with other tasks associated withturning/leaning (such as shifting body weight/position). So identifying the movement in your turningroutine might be difficult.

While dirtbike riders are used to throwing their body around to initiate lean on a dirt track, I doubtone can produce the necessary lean required to maneuver a big heavy cruiser simply by shifting body position. There's counter-steering going on in addition to the body movements.

Maybe on the way home from work I'll try to prove myself wrongby seeing if I can initiate lean *only* by adjusting body weight.

You're body can/willcountersteer naturally with out you knowing, and I think that explains some of the more veteran riders who do not believe they counter-steer; they're just doing what comes natural.

I'm definitely no veteran, but I've read and read about countersteering because it was such an unnatural movement for me at first that I was obsessed with understanding it. Now, it's a completely natural fluid movement and one of the most run parts of riding - leaning thathog waaaaay over.

 

May I please respectfully disagree? You keep that pressure there the whole time to counteract the centrifugal force that is trying to stand you back up, lean you over, and send you to the outside of the turn.

You make turns with your wheel turned slightly opposite of the direction you want to go.

I explained it earlier, but it's like a dixie cup. Lay it on a table on its side and roll it. It will roll in a circle, around its base, because the base has the smaller diameter compared to the drinking rim.

Motorcycle (and bicycle) tires are like that but more so. They have a much bigger diameter in the center than out near the edges. If they lean, they turn just like that cup. There is no choice.

The counter steer just leans the bike to get that tire diameter differential into play and then that does the turning. The "dixie cup" principle is so strong that it will overcome a slight counter steer.

Because at speed the bike is always trying to lay over to the outside of a turn (centrifugal force,) you have to counter-act that and "you ain't big enough." Besides, your body has those same "to the outside" forces on it.

Only the leverage on the handle bars will give you enough power to lean the bike strongly against the forces in a turn and that's done with the counter steer.

If any one hasn't taken a bike out on a deserted road, got it up to about 20 mph and gently and slowly sawed the handle bars back and forth to see that the bike is marvelous at turning with fabulous control in the opposite direction you steer, and then coming right back when you push the other way, just try it. Might save your life some day in a quick slalom to avoid an obstacle or when you are having a problem in a curve.

Ride safe folks.

JB

 

I also don't want readers to get the impression that once you press forward and lean, no more pressure is needed, so thanks for clarifying. My apologies for not being more clear.

Of course, as you noted,oneis to keep pressureon the grip.Iwas being careful to make clear that one does not increasingly push forwardon the grip (i.e., you only push enough to create the lean necessary to achieve the appropriate turning radius).

I suppose I assumedmy description of increasing/decreasing the turning radius to change lane position through out a curve was sufficient to relay the fact that constant pressure is applied.

Regarding the"you ain't big enough" principle you mentioned... thatis precisely why I have a hard time believing dirtbike guys throw their weight around on their big cruisers to create their turns. I'm by no means callin' anyone a liar, butconsidering the forces involved, and the mass of both objects (your body versus the bike)... it does notseem likely.