Does anyone even know if the new ECMs have a data port? Will it allow access to the AFR tables? There's been a lot of guessing, but right now no one knows. How hard did the EPA slap Harley when they nailed them?

 

MoCo was fined like $12 -$15 Million which is nothing but chump change to them.

I haven't had any of the SE turners since my 2005 springer. What do the SEPRT/SERT cost, $400.00-$500?

I read on any ther forum, they sold like over 500,000 units between 2008-2014.

Being conservative, at $400.00 a Turner, that EQUALS $200,000,000.00 in that short period of time.


YB

 

Nothing I don't think. Harley got in trouble because they were installing the tuner on a new bike....thus circumventing the EPA laws. I think FP3, Power Commander & Power Vision..etc. will be around for a while. My concern is if the 2017 ECM's may be set up or "locked" where they can't be flashed beyond EPA specs. Just my thoughts mind you.

 

I think it depends on what the EPA has up it's sleeve- I think they could go after the aftermarket tuner folk the same way as they went after HD. The disclaimer that the SE Tuners were for off road/Racing Use only didn't save them. Technically not sure if it matters if they were sold or installed new bikes or not. The law, as I understand it, is that it is not legal to modify something so that it exceeds the EPA limits for air pollution (or however it's worded). Not sure if the EPA has the manpower, budget or desire to go any further with this, or if they're hoping that others selling these devices see what happened to HD and change their "evil" ways.
Hopefully this will all just blow over and the EPA moves onto some other priority. But I'd guess if they choose to target the aftermarket, they'd be able to do what they did with HD. Time will tell, I guess.

 

Harley is not the only brand of M/C that people tune. Good luck to the EPA trying to stop it. Then there is the performance market for cars which is far greater than the M/C market.

I think it's going to drive the value up on pre-85 bikes where the EPA laws don't matter.

 

I have been building custom cars sense the 70s and you can buy all kinds of race type tuners they always say off road use only here in virginia if you live in a area where they have emissions you will fail. Car aftermarket parts have been like that sense the EPA.It has been the law sense emission standards that you can not tamper with devices to defeat that purpose.No car manufacture would ever sell a car from dealership that will not pass inspection.Harley has been lucky to make it this long.

 

once you buy the bike you can put whatever you want on it in virginia motorcycles don't have to go thru emissions . What this will do is you will have to go to a indy shop to add on tuners that are not EPA compliant.

 

clean air matters...

I know EPA went after pipe makers like Vance & Hines pretty hard, with big fines.

Those guys, reading a forum like this, is like waiving a red flag in front of a bull.

 

The tuners, I don't think, are illegal. It's what you do with them to modify EPA compliant vehicles that is the problem.

 

Reading the actual consent decree that appears to be the case. They ran their bikes through EPA certification but were offering to alter the bikes to a non compliant mode.

Fuel moto just posted that they have a way into the ECM but that is all that they stated. I would assume that Harley would not block out the aftermarket since the EPA not the competition shut down that portion of their business. There is nothing in it for them at this point. If they could have done that they would have when they were selling a competing device.