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Yeah, my memory can be messing with me too. Need more coffee.
Would be nice to find out which Dyon Bob has.
Talk about needing more coffee..............I just remembered who Bob(FLTRI) @ RC Cycles is. I hear he is one of the best, if not THE BEST in the business. Extremely insightful and knowlegable on other forums.
Props to both tuner and JCleary.
__________________ 2007 UltraClassic\103"BB\.030 Cometic Head Gasket\SE 255's Doherty PowerPACC w/vents\Supertrapp SE's\SERT\Bagger Brace M1 15W-50 incrank\Redline MTL in Primary\Redline Shockproof in Tranny My other toy!
Last edited by UltraKla$$ic; 11-07-2009 at 10:37 AM.
"The best"????? Might be pushing it a little with that. LOL
"The best" at starting debates and arguments, then deleting, changing posts to look like a saint. Loves to start threads on touchy subjects. The Master at baiting.
Pretty knowledgeable guy though, if he could only lose the attitude.
BTW: I do recall him bragging that he does all his runs in SIXTH gear! (splains your doubt in the numbers a bit?)
He claims it is the only "proper" way (even though your rear tire might come apart at that speed). Gear ratio @ WOT.
Not even going to answer to misled.... Bob is the best on the west coast and well worth time on the dyno. looking forward to my next visit with him... was there two weeks ago for the first time after reading all about him in the HTT site. he wants you to be there with him during the dyno and first class operation. just remember to dress very warm when you go LOL
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2000 Road King Classic, Hillside 98 c.i. Big Boyz Heads, Andrews 26G gear drive w\ 1.725 rockers, 48mm HPI, SERT, Thunderheader 2:1, Quadzilla Fairing, Race Tech Gold Valve forks, Home built air ride, Sta-Bo bushing and 08 swing arm.
Yeah, my memory can be messing with me too. Need more coffee.
Would be nice to find out which Dyno Bob has.
Quote:
Originally Posted by UltraKla$$ic
Absolutely nothing personal regarding you JCLeary, but a dynotuner can make those dynonumbers reflect anything they want them too, but in reality, the hardware is virtually incapable of producing said numbers.
Ok, so I know you're skeptical...
Numbers were done on a dynojet with a SAE correction factor of .97.
Any given Dynojet model has the same roller, the same resistance, anywhere in the country by model. Period. It takes a given amount of horsepower/torque to spin a given weight up to speed in a given amount of time. This is a constant, and why a Dynojet is so good for comparing dyno numbers from location to location.
SAE correction factors are there to even the playing field, whether you're in the SF Bay Area with good air, or huffing thin air in Colorado. A Colorado correction factor might be 1.15.
Really the number that matters is UNCORRECTED horsepower. The SAE skewed numbers on the dyno sheet are LOWER than our bikes made yesterday. Add three percent to any of our numbers, and you get what OUR bikes put out YESTERDAY. On a 90 degree day, it will most certainly be different, much lower in fact.
Believe it or leave it, the bikes made what they made.
It's not like a pure eddy-current dyno, where you can actually tweak the resistance and skew numbers.
I learned a lot about dyno brands and styles over the past 6 years with my diesel truck addiction...
And the tuner is key. If your tuner doesn't have the experience, he will leave a LOT on the table. Run-to-run I could have a 10%+ difference in performance based on the settings of my fueling/timing devices in my Dodge. Only once did I have a magic day with 555/963 uncorrected fuel only. The torque curve looked like a HP graph though. I threw on a smaller turbo, changed some settings and dynoed again, lost 50hp and 20 tq, but the torque curve was flat as a table. Tuning is key.
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2010 Vivid Black FLHX, SE Heavy Breather, Woods TW6-6, Mastertune, Thunderheader and a worn out right grip...
Impressive numbers, hows the valvetrain noise with those cams?
Not bad. You can hear them, but I've heard much worse. The most noise you hear is the throttle body butterfly rattling from the valves opening so quick.
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2010 Vivid Black FLHX, SE Heavy Breather, Woods TW6-6, Mastertune, Thunderheader and a worn out right grip...
I certainly don't need to defend Bob in any way.... but Faast Ed I think you have that mixed up, it was 5th that he does his dyno on the twin cam and fourth gear on the stock evo, most dyno guys around here do it in 4th gear.
JCleary, I thought I recognize the name, your on the DTR forum? I was a trainer for Cummins Diesel till I got laid off three months ago.
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2000 Road King Classic, Hillside 98 c.i. Big Boyz Heads, Andrews 26G gear drive w\ 1.725 rockers, 48mm HPI, SERT, Thunderheader 2:1, Quadzilla Fairing, Race Tech Gold Valve forks, Home built air ride, Sta-Bo bushing and 08 swing arm.
Numbers were done on a dynojet with a SAE correction factor of .97.
Any given Dynojet model has the same roller, the same resistance, anywhere in the country by model. Period. It takes a given amount of horsepower/torque to spin a given weight up to speed in a given amount of time. This is a constant, and why a Dynojet is so good for comparing dyno numbers from location to location.
SAE correction factors are there to even the playing field, whether you're in the SF Bay Area with good air, or huffing thin air in Colorado. A Colorado correction factor might be 1.15.
Did Bob tell you that crap?
Nothing personal, but "any Dynojet" is NOT equal.
Do some research on the DJ250 "i" model that superseded the others.
The DJ150 gave you numbers that made you think you had a rocket bike.
The DJ250 became a little more accurate, but still generous.
The DJ250 "i" model became known as the "honest" dyno, and some even call them the "stingy" dyno. (I do). The TRUE ruler of comparison! (Winpep 7 software).
Then there is the "which gear" problem. MOST dyno tuners use 5th gear (on a 6 speed) and 4rth gear (on a 5 speed). Using any other gear skews the numbers.
Bob at RC himself told us at HTT that he uses 6th gear and feels it's "proper". (ask him yourself).
You aren't the only one who's spent a lot of time around dyno's, the difference is that I have been around "bike" dyno environments.
Your numbers look good and I would be proud. (yes we look at correction factors).
But 6th gear will make the tuner look better as well as a happy dyno.
Numbers aren't relative until you compare what the "before" numbers were (on the same dyno). Where's your base run? My tuner always trys to get a base run (before build).
Unless you plan on painting the numbers on your tank, all that TRULY matters is that your bike runs great!
You don't need to defend your numbers. We all know the bike runs great. The 6's are indeed a great cam. (And we know that Bob can tune).
I certainly don't need to defend Bob in any way.... but Faast Ed I think you have that mixed up, it was 5th that he does his dyno on the twin cam and fourth gear on the stock evo, most dyno guys around here do it in 4th gear.
Ask him. He not only told the entire board (at HTT) that he does 6th on a six speed, 5th on a 5 speed. He defended it in an argumentative way. Ask him yourself.
Unless he's changed his methods,..... and I doubt that he has.
(Should be in the dyno notes, which gear the run was in).
