You are currently viewing our forum as a guest, which gives you limited access to view most discussions and access our other features. By joining our community, at no cost, you will have access to post topics, communicate privately with other members (PM), respond to polls, upload content and access many other special features. Registration is free, fast and simple, join HDForums.com community today!
1. to improve fuel economy/emissions by eliminating throttle twitches (as stated above) anybody does not believe that can be a factor, go ride a Honda VTX1800 over a bumpy road. Computer could theoretically be taught to anaylize your riding habbits (throttle input/engine load/speed/gear selected, in order to be more efficient.
2. to eliminate maintenance.
3. Makes cruise control cheaper/easier to add-just plug the module in.
4. they can limit bikes to a certain top speed for safety reasons (FLH front end tank slappers at triple digit speeds?)
5. Cheaper/easier to assemble
6. Hopefully one less thing to break in the middle of knowhere and leave you stranded (cables) HOPEFULLY
7. Once its adopted on all bikes, fewer different length throttle cables need to be kept in stock at dealerships, lowering parts inventory. (it costs a lot of money having unused parts made and sitting in inventory, in CASE you need them) They can just have one length of wires, and bundle them up/wire tie the excess inside the bars.
8. Cleaner look on handlebars.
This ad is not displayed to registered and logged-in members. Register your free account today and become a member on HD Forums!
1. Eliminates extra module for Cruise Control (all internal to the ECM now, savesproduction cost)
2. Eliminates throttle cables and ties (again, saves production cost)
3. Eliminates extra content on the throttle body (cost savings)
4. Gives more precise control of throttle response (an improvement)
5. Fewer parts, easier to repair (content cost)
I'm not sure about emissions being the driver for this change, I think it was financial. It probably saves MoCo 3-4 hundred per bike to assemble.
__________________
08 Road Glide
Candy Red Sunglo
Hogtunes, Pro 1 Wheels (Frt 21x3.5, Rear 18x4.5), Avons, Wild1 WO513s, SE Touring Mufflers, PC V Stage1, Cee Baileys, Tour Pak, Back Rest, Rear Stabilizer & other stuff
TBW places the computer in full control of throttle......the twist grip is used for you to input your desires...the ecm then responds as per it's programed curves.
You can dial up wide open throttle, but bike will respond only as ecm allows.....ecm uses muli inputs to determine how fast bike acells/decells and will not allow bike to polute like with cables.
This is the main reason I do not like the TBW. I am all for advancements/improvements, BUT NOT ones that put a layer of separation between me and my bike.
I LIKE being able to turn off the fuel, I like having a reserve, I LIKE having a choke, while I would not mind having an auto tensioner for the primary...I LIKE having an inspection plate to be able to check the primary.
What? That's all fine and good, just stick to riding old bikes. Some of the people who ride Harley's are the same ones trying to kill the company.........I don't get it.
You wouldn't godrop 20 grand ona new Chevy truck with manual choke, no power steering or brakes and no a/c.
To me, it's about the ride. A choke or fuel valve or throttle cable has nothing to do with enjoying the open road. That's like not riding because you don't have the right do-rag to wear.
__________________
2008 Street Glide
Every mile a memory...............
1. Eliminates extra module for Cruise Control (all internal to the ECM now, savesproduction cost)
2. Eliminates throttle cables and ties (again, saves production cost)
3. Eliminates extra content on the throttle body (cost savings)
4. Gives more precise control of throttle response (an improvement)
5. Fewer parts, easier to repair (content cost)
I'm not sure about emissions being the driver for this change, I think it was financial. It probably saves MoCo 3-4 hundred per bike to assemble.
The reason emissions output is improved is because the system eliminates small unintentional increases in throttle input. No the motor is not burning cleaner at a given input rather it burning cleaner because it is seeing less throttle input. As stated above the motor now runs along a programed curve for any condition so emissions output is better controlled. The same applies to fuel economy.
__________________
2007 Street Glide - Formerly a clattering bucket of bolts.
**************
Frikken Stock!
OK, with the same size engine and fuel injection system, how can the TBW enhance emissions and fuel economy?
+1 Please tell us how, I always like to read a good piece of fiction.
1. Dinosaur
2. Read the posts in this thread - I know its hard but you just may learn something
It smooths out twitches from your hand and on the throttle. Whether you know it or not your hand is constantly moving. The TBW knows the difference between a twitching hand and an intentional change in throttle input. It is one of the reasons the 08 bikes are rated for higher fuel economy than the 07s. Same goes for emissions.
Oh, you must mean I didn't read this first post of yours. I did read it and I don't buy a bit of it because you have no proof of your statements and just because you stated this does not make it fact like many thingsthat people post on the Internet or on this forum. I also don't need to be told that I might learn something by reading the posts in a thread since I always do. And just because someone posts their ideas about something doesn't make it fact. I also think the primary reason for the change was to save manufacturing costs.
__________________
2006 Road King FLHRI/Deep Cobalt
Stage 1/SE A/C K&N Filter/SERT
SE Pro Performance Exhaust
OK, with the same size engine and fuel injection system, how can the TBW enhance emissions and fuel economy?
+1 Please tell us how, I always like to read a good piece of fiction.
1. Dinosaur
2. Read the posts in this thread - I know its hard but you just may learn something
It smooths out twitches from your hand and on the throttle. Whether you know it or not your hand is constantly moving. The TBW knows the difference between a twitching hand and an intentional change in throttle input. It is one of the reasons the 08 bikes are rated for higher fuel economy than the 07s. Same goes for emissions.
Oh, you must mean I didn't read this first post of yours. I did read it and I don't buy a bit of it because you have no proof of your statements and just because you stated this does not make it fact like many thingsthat people post on the Internet or on this forum. I also don't need to be told that I might learn something by reading the posts in a thread since I always do. And just because someone posts their ideas about something doesn't make it fact.
Not too bright eh? Dude this is old technology long proven in automobiles. Read the rest of the posts, from several engineers I might add. BTW several guys are mechanical engineers. I come at this from a computer engineering stand point. Computer control allows for more precise control of any process.
BTW I really just find you are not very bright.
__________________
2007 Street Glide - Formerly a clattering bucket of bolts.
**************
Frikken Stock!
ORIGINAL: Mississippi Bagger
I LIKE being able to turn off the fuel, I like having a reserve, I LIKE having a choke, while I would not mind having an auto tensioner for the primary...I LIKE having an inspection plate to be able to check the primary.
I like tinkering with that stuff also, but remember years ago an engine would flood out in cold weather. Not today because if you try to open the throttle on start up the ECM says "I'll give stupid 5 seconds to close the throttle and if he doesn't I'll do it for him". That's just one reason. Probably others like throwing raw fuel down the exhaust, etc., etc.
__________________
You are never lost if you don't care where you are.
USCG 1966-1972
2008 FLHR (ABS, Security, CC, Zumo 550, Jackpot Dyno tuned, PC V retrofit, Fuel Moto SE Stage 1 air cleaner )
I respectfully disagree (not in a mean way, but in the spirit of debate). Movement is movement regardless of a throttle cable, FBW or Throttle Body servomotor.
Unintentional movement is resolved via a sampling bias programmed into the ECU code (smoothing subroutine).
IMHO, FBW don't have anything to do with the emissions sub-system. Throttle is just an input device.
__________________
08 Road Glide
Candy Red Sunglo
Hogtunes, Pro 1 Wheels (Frt 21x3.5, Rear 18x4.5), Avons, Wild1 WO513s, SE Touring Mufflers, PC V Stage1, Cee Baileys, Tour Pak, Back Rest, Rear Stabilizer & other stuff
I respectfully disagree (not in a mean way, but in the spirit of debate). Movement is movement regardless of a throttle cable, FBW or Throttle Body servomotor.
Unintentional movement is resolved via a sampling bias programmed into the ECU code (smoothing subroutine).
IMHO, FBW don't have anything to do with the emissions sub-system. Throttle is just an input device.
I don't disagree with your description of the movement and how it works but what don't agree with you on is the response to input. Maybe the MotorCo set the thing up analog but I can't see why they would do that. You lose the advantage digital control allows including ignoring spurious input. I'm pretty certain (although not positive) it is digital allowing for very precise control to throttle input. One of the biggest complaints Ford had when the went to TBW was sluggish response because the computer was spending too much time determining if the driver really wanted to do that or it was just a random twitch on the gas pedal. 07s were rated at 45MPG and the 08 at 54MPG. I'm pretty certain TBW has a lot to do with this.
__________________
2007 Street Glide - Formerly a clattering bucket of bolts.
**************
Frikken Stock!
RE: Reason MOCO went to TBW? Opinions?
