manual starter lever
Stage III
Joined: Sep 2009
Posts: 3
Likes: 0
From: Michigan
Its available as a PDF download from the JP Cycles website. Not the greatest legibility though ...
http://www.jpcycles.com/Search/Produ...results=10&No=
http://www.jpcycles.com/Search/Produ...results=10&No=
Thread Starter
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Novice
Joined: Jun 2009
Posts: 17
Likes: 1
From: western Virginia
In re JP manual starter kit wiring, my technical adviser failed to show up. (It's really hard to find reliable help nowadays.) But I am not going to let him off the hook. He is my cousin, and lives close by, so I'll catch him sooner or later.
Will advise.
Will advise.
Thread Starter
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Novice
Joined: Jun 2009
Posts: 17
Likes: 1
From: western Virginia
This thread should perhaps be renamed "The Manual Starter Kit From Hell." After many hours spent with the volt/ohm meter, trying to figure out why the starter remained engaged when the lever was released and the circuit allegedly broken, I today discovered that the starter shaft floats after tension is gone from the lever, as long as the starter cranks, and maintains continuity on the switch. Now, all I have to do is pull the lid off the primary ("primairy," according to the enclosed instructions) housing, and figure out why.
More items as they develop.
More items as they develop.
Thread Starter
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Novice
Joined: Jun 2009
Posts: 17
Likes: 1
From: western Virginia
The plot thickens
After a number of hours with a volt/ohmmeter, trying to figure out why the starter remained engaged when the lever was released, but only when torque was applied from the starter, (when the motor is not engaged, the relay and solenoids function flawlessly) we popped the lid off the aluminum lever housing, and found something quite amazing: although the lever returned to the disengaged position, the shaft which it activates remained forward, and kept the circuit ground connection closed. Friction between the teeth on the Bendix and those of the flywheel is obviously enough to prevent the bell crank from disengaging the gears.
If I could figure out how to include an attachment, I would show you the arrangement. It is a balance of springs and washers on the shaft, which, on each side of the bellcrank, is supposed to balance a forward motion to engage the Bendix/flywheel, and upon release, disengage the gears and break the electrical circuit.
It appears that the that the starter shaft needs a more powerful spring forward of the bellcrank, in order to push it aft when the handle is released, thus disengaging the Bendix and flywheel.
I feel rather like Captain Ahab, with his bloody whale.
More later.
[IMG]file:///C:/picsave/shaftsprings.jpg[/IMG]
If I could figure out how to include an attachment, I would show you the arrangement. It is a balance of springs and washers on the shaft, which, on each side of the bellcrank, is supposed to balance a forward motion to engage the Bendix/flywheel, and upon release, disengage the gears and break the electrical circuit.
It appears that the that the starter shaft needs a more powerful spring forward of the bellcrank, in order to push it aft when the handle is released, thus disengaging the Bendix and flywheel.
I feel rather like Captain Ahab, with his bloody whale.
More later.
[IMG]file:///C:/picsave/shaftsprings.jpg[/IMG]
Stage III
Joined: Sep 2009
Posts: 3
Likes: 0
From: Michigan
Wow, I am really re-evaluating whether I want this thing near the bike after reading this thread. It sure seemed like a good concept, but it sounds like its kinda lacking in the execution ...
The problem you mentioned with the starter not disengaging - is this a problem associated with the arm of the manual lever, or do you think its an issue with the existing situation (engagement of starter and flywheel gears) ... in other words, is it a manual lever problem? Could a stronger spring be fitted?
Thanks for sharing your experiences with this.
Bill
The problem you mentioned with the starter not disengaging - is this a problem associated with the arm of the manual lever, or do you think its an issue with the existing situation (engagement of starter and flywheel gears) ... in other words, is it a manual lever problem? Could a stronger spring be fitted?
Thanks for sharing your experiences with this.
Bill
Thread Starter
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Novice
Joined: Jun 2009
Posts: 17
Likes: 1
From: western Virginia
One should think twice before attempting to install this device. It is, indeed, a good basic idea. The original solenoid and relay are prone to malfunction due to weather. The relay fails due to moisture (as in parking outside overnight), and the solenoid refuses to function when it's cold. The problem lies in poor manufacturing quality control in the kit, and lack of installation instructions.
Captain Ahab has, however, not given up.
Captain Ahab has, however, not given up.
Stage I
Joined: Apr 2010
Posts: 1
Likes: 0
Just mounted one on my '76, yes the instructions do kinda suck, and it was a bit of a pain. But its on now, it only took 2 days, and it works awesome and looks pretty cool.
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6th Gear
Joined: Aug 2009
Posts: 10
Likes: 1
From: Redstone, CO
Did you ever get this problem worked out? I was thinking about buying the lever because my starter won't disengage with the stock system on my '79 FXE. I have had it apart numerous times and can't quite figure out why. I'm thinking the solenoid is bad or the 30 year old spring is too weak or the plunger is worn or...... Now I hear you had the same problem with the lever.
Thread Starter
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Novice
Joined: Jun 2009
Posts: 17
Likes: 1
From: western Virginia
yes and no
Yo, Turtle!
On my '67, I have it working (sort of), but it still needs adjustment, I haven't had the energy to pull the primary cover off again. The adjustment mentioned above consists of a delicate balance of springs and spacers on the manual activator shaft. A good H-D mechanic would probably have no trouble with it, BUT I definitely would not recommend it as a home project (I am speaking from personal experience). The wiring is a bit tricky, but can be done.
Do NOT expect help from JP. The tekkies there know nothing more about it than we do, and they do not speak Mandarin.
If you can get it installed and working, it will eliminate the solenoid electrical problems, and it looks really cool. But I repeat, it is NOT a project for the unskilled.
On my '67, I have it working (sort of), but it still needs adjustment, I haven't had the energy to pull the primary cover off again. The adjustment mentioned above consists of a delicate balance of springs and spacers on the manual activator shaft. A good H-D mechanic would probably have no trouble with it, BUT I definitely would not recommend it as a home project (I am speaking from personal experience). The wiring is a bit tricky, but can be done.
Do NOT expect help from JP. The tekkies there know nothing more about it than we do, and they do not speak Mandarin.
If you can get it installed and working, it will eliminate the solenoid electrical problems, and it looks really cool. But I repeat, it is NOT a project for the unskilled.